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Piracy Privacy The Internet

Swedish Pirate Party Launches ISP 356

Posted by kdawson
from the nothing-to-declare dept.
WillDraven writes "Torrentfreak is reporting that the Swedish Pirate Party has launched an ISP. Starting with 100 residents in a housing organization in the city of Lund, Pirate ISP hopes to gain 5% of the market in Lund before spreading to other markets. Headed by longtime Pirate Party member Gustav Nipe (video interview in English), the company aims to provide Internet service with the sort of guarantees one would expect from the Pirate Party. Most notable are the promises to keep no logs of subscriber activity and thus to provide no data to law enforcement or private corporations."
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Swedish Pirate Party Launches ISP

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  • by Shikaku (1129753) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @03:46PM (#32970184)

    Please spread to other countries...

    • There was an article a while back... They applied to be a party in Canada, and they have been approved (don't know if they've actually formed a party yet or not).

      I imagine if its a big hit there, and it spreads over here... Well I mean we manage to slip past some of the more Draconian IP laws of the States by putting taxes on blank media and such - I wonder if offering this service to Canada would cause a stir...

    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      it really doesn't matter that a retail ISP doesn't keep logs... their upstream providers already have all their traffic mirrored and monitored by the NSA. [arstechnica.com]
    • by Yvanhoe (564877) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @04:05PM (#32970472) Journal
      Well it depends on you for a big part : http://www.pp-international.net/ [pp-international.net]
      Sweden has exceptional political conditions. Germany is coming up to speed. But tentative national pirate parties exist in many countries.
    • Sounds awesome, can't wait to sign up.
    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by bjourne (1034822)
      God damn. Get off your chair, get the thumb out of your ass and start your own party you lazy fatso. The revolution won't happen all by itself you know.
  • I predict... (Score:2, Interesting)

    by f3rret (1776822)

    That The **AA's are just going to love this idea.

    I suspect that they'll just set up bulk mailers to send DMCA notices to this ISP's abuse@ address, every time a new movie, album or anything is released a mail gets sent to abuse@pirateisp.com because no doubt a copy of said work is bound to exist somewhere on their network.

    • Re:I predict... (Score:5, Interesting)

      by bsDaemon (87307) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @03:51PM (#32970258)

      and I bet the Pirate Party and the network engineers and system administrators that they hire will be at least smart enough to straight filter, either at the packet level at the border, or application level on the mail servers, any traffic coming from IP ranges known to belong to the RIAA, MPAA, or constituent organizations. That's what I'd do. Or segment abuse@ off on its own area, let it take the hammering, and spit all the addresses back via feedback loops and get their email black listed. Or... run the mail server on OpenBSD, where spamd is linked to pf, and accept the incoming connections from their mass-mailer at 1bps, thus backlogging the sender and screwing them over (disk i/o issues, etc). Fun stuff like that.

      • Re: (Score:2, Flamebait)

        by MobyDisk (75490) *

        any traffic coming from IP ranges known to belong to the RIAA, MPAA, or constituent organizations.

        IMHO, that would be doing exactly what their enemies are doing. Their purpose is to let users access the internet without restrictions. Not to wall-off those things they find evil.

        • Re:I predict... (Score:4, Informative)

          by Andorin (1624303) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @04:12PM (#32970562)
          You left out the "on the mail servers" part of his post. Meaning that the filtering is done for incoming email to the ISP itself, not traffic in general.
        • by bsDaemon (87307)

          Blocking incoming traffic that isn't in a TCP session already associated with an egress port is not the same thing as filtering internet access for their customers. It's responsible security administration. Besides, how many of their customers do you think even want to have any communication with the RIAA anyway? I'd wager not a lot.

    • Re:I predict... (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Zedrick (764028) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @03:54PM (#32970304)
      Then this ISP can set up an autoreply that gets triggered by "DMCA" in the body, informing the sender that the DMCA is an american law and totally irrelevant in most other countries. (though writing such replies manually can be a lot of fun, I did plenty of that when I worked as abuse-handler at a large webhost in Denmark. A lot of American lawyer-types really can't get it into their thick skulls that american laws are not universal, and if they have a valid complaint they need to say so (and be specific!) instead of just waving around a wand, trying to invoke the magical DMCA.)
    • Re:I predict... (Score:5, Informative)

      by AndrewNeo (979708) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @03:56PM (#32970338) Homepage

      Yes, because the ** Association of America will send DMCA (an American law) notices to a Swedish ISP. You know what the Pirate Bay does with those letters now? They post them up on a page and laugh at them.

  • ... people start using it for child pornography transfer and other things that SHOULD be illegal.
    • by MrEricSir (398214) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @03:48PM (#32970222) Homepage

      But isn't it better to trust people with freedom than to treat everyone like criminals?

      • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

        by endymion.nz (1093595)
        I dunno.. they might do something I have a moral objection too, not necessarily a criminal act. :(
        • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @03:55PM (#32970328)

          I'm not sure if you're trolling or trying to be funny but that's just fucking scary.

      • by RLiegh (247921) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @03:57PM (#32970356) Homepage Journal

        That's a false dichotomy. You can be allowed freedom to speak while still being able to be found when you use that freedom to engage in criminal activities or to organize acts of terrorist destruction.

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Score Whore (32328)

        I'm not going to make assumptions about how long you've been on the internet and what not, but in case you weren't here in the early days, an open and free network is what it was. The sad fact is is that there are enough people who abused the system such that what you have today is the end result.

        • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

          by Andorin (1624303)
          Oh, yes. All the problems of the Internet were brought upon us because people misbehaved, and had nothing to do with corporate lockdown, monopolization and commercialization.
    • by stagg (1606187) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @03:49PM (#32970238)
      And? People use highways for illegal things. They use their homes for illegal things. Hell, they probably use government buildings for illegal things. Cracking down on freedoms in the name of a minority of miscreants is never a good thing.
      • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

        by easterberry (1826250)
        I'm pretty sure the cops patrol and watch the highways and, with a warrant, can go into your home if there are reports of crimes there.

        Are you implying it would be better if they couldn't/didn't?
        • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @04:06PM (#32970488)

          If you want to make analogies, do it right. There is no "just in case" recording of everything I do in my home so that cops can get a warrant and watch what I did. Even for "live" investigations, there's a high legal barrier before a cop can enter my home. If someone just accuses me of stealing something, it is not sufficient for a warrant. On the internet, with most ISPs, not only is there a record which ties my online activities to my identity, there's also almost no barrier if someone wants to access that information.

        • by HungryHobo (1314109) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @04:07PM (#32970500)

          logging every site that every user visits through an ISP just in case law enforcement want to check up on it later to see if they're viewing illegal material is like putting a camera in every bedroom just in case law enforcement want to check up on it later to see if you've been raping victims in the room.

          an equivalent to a warrant to search your house would be a warrant to search your computer not having your ISP recording everything you view for future inspection.

    • by BitterOak (537666) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @03:52PM (#32970270)

      ... people start using it for child pornography transfer and other things that SHOULD be illegal.

      This is precisely why these things shouldn't be illegal. At least, possession and transfer of information (including child pornography) shouldn't be illegal. (Of course, abusing children to make child pornography should be illegal, and child pornography itself could very well be evidence of a crime.) The problem is, as soon as you make certain kinds of information illegal, then it would be impossible for ISPs to provide the kind of anonymity many of us would desire. Child pornography makes a wonderful excuse to impose strict data retention laws that affect a wide variety of users.

      • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @04:46PM (#32971156)
        Child pornography is a red herring, a talking point cynically trotted out by politicians and duly repeated ad nauseam by the unthinking masses. I've seen nothing to suggest that its prevalence is any more than anecdotal, yet it is repeatedly used as an excuse to promulgate laws that shape the future of our society. It's our time's Emmanuel Goldstein and The Brotherhood [wikipedia.org].
    • Oh noes the child porn card! If your going down that road why not push for a ban on blank DVD's, digital cameras, haribo sweeties and internet chat rooms, all of which can and no doubt are used in some way for child exploitation and child porn production.
  • Kind of Sad... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by ceraphis (1611217) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @03:53PM (#32970292)
    ...that a special ISP has to be launched to get the type of protections every ISP should have.
  • Assuming it's not, why would any license holder need logs to prosecute? All they would need are billing records. I doubt anyone could successfully make an argument they are not pirating software/videos/etc while paying to use 'Pirate ISP'.
    • If the ISP doesn't maintain records of the dynamic IPs they give out to customers, then there is no way to associate a supposedly-violating IP to a customer billing address. The ISP won't have the data to help out the authorities and their investigations will thus be fruitless. This of course assumes that the ISP has enough customers that it isn't trivially easy to identify which one was using that IP address. Even having a few dozen customers should be enough to make it impossible to associate some web tra
  • by Rik Sweeney (471717) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @04:02PM (#32970420) Homepage

    How much will it be per month? How much can I transfer per month? Is there a time when downloading is unlimited (such as weekends or between 10pm and 8am). Will they throttle the line during peak hours? What speed can I expect?

    Logging my BT transfers is the least of my concerns when choosing an ISP.

    • Re:Limits? (Score:5, Informative)

      by Zironic (1112127) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @04:25PM (#32970830)

      Swedish ISP's as a rule don't have limits and tend to cost something along the line of $10 to $40 depending on bandwidth and extra services.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by smallfries (601545)

      We currently pay about 300kr a month for a 30Mb connection. I think that's about 30euro / 25pounds / $40. We don't get throttled and there are no limits as far as I know. BT tends to max out at 3MB/s on popular torrents, lower than that if the swarm isn't big enough to saturate the line.

      There are cheaper packages available, and our ISP goes up to 100Mb/s symmetric.

  • by slick7 (1703596) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @04:19PM (#32970700)
    Would that be Pirate_Party.arg?
  • by Nethead (1563) <joe@nethead.com> on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @04:20PM (#32970712) Homepage Journal

    That's going to be fun for the admins when the server falls over and they need to figure out why. /var/log is there for a reason.

  • Idiots! (Score:4, Insightful)

    by zmollusc (763634) on Tuesday July 20, 2010 @05:28PM (#32971642)

    The stupid pirate party and the stupid Swedish government have just handed a huge propaganda victory to the RIAA. Within a week the entire swedish economy will have ground to a halt and terrorists will be overrunning sweden and building WMDs! Then the RIAA will say "We told you so! Look what happens when ordinary people are allowed freedom!"

"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro..." -- Hunter S. Thompson

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