IRS Wants a Cut of Sales On eBay and Craigslist 517
Ponca City, We love you writes "In 2009, $60 billion worth of items were sold on eBay, meaning 'extra' money for many sellers, whose activities may provide them with taxable income. Now the Washington Post reports that beginning next year, a new law will require 'the gross amount of payment card and third-party network transactions to be reported annually to participating merchants and the IRS.' Also, for 2011 tax returns, 'taxpayers who annually sell more than $20,000 worth of goods and have more than 200 electronic transactions' will receive a new IRS form, known as 1099-K, for reporting the proceeds. The new tax issues shouldn't be a concern for people who sell just a few small items online for less than they paid for them, because as the IRS points out, income from auctions that resemble a garage or yard sale 'generally' isn't required to be reported. But if an online garage sale turns into a business with recurring sales and purchases of items for resale, it may be considered an online auction business. 'Generally, transactions resulting in a gain are reportable, regardless of whether the taxpayer is conducting a business,' says Gil Charney, principal tax researcher at The Tax Institute at H&R Block. The real reason behind the law is simple: Research shows taxpayers do a much better job of reporting taxable income when they know the IRS is receiving information about their transactions."
it's worse than that (Score:5, Informative)
Already taxable (Score:2, Informative)
Re:it's worse than that (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Privacy (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Well for starters (Score:5, Informative)
it means that they will have to collect your Taxpayer ID number and then validate it.
so no illegal alliens can use E-bay.
Perhaps you weren't aware that illegal aliens can get a ITIN (Individual Taxpayer Identification Number) [irs.gov] from the IRS, and can actually report and file 1040s every year with that same TIN. Even when here illegally (thus making their entire income illegal).
The IRS doesn't care as long as you pay taxes, unless they feel you didn't pay enough, then it's up to you to prove you paid enough not up to the IRS to prove you didn't.
1099's have been around for a long time (Score:1, Informative)
So, what you're saying is that you've been avoiding/evading paying taxes in the past? The requirement for 1099s for $600 or more has been around for a long time. The fact that people are ignorant of the rules doesn't really change that. Yes, you as a payer now have a slightly increased paperwork burden to actually fill out the 3 boxes on the form (name& address, TIN, and dollar amount), but I don't see that it's a huge issue. It's not like there's a filing fee for the 1099s, and if you're *in business* then annual recordkeeping isn't a big deal, eh?
Re:Deductions (Score:2, Informative)
You can (and should) deduct your IRS allowed capital purchases from your INCOME, not your income tax (deductions from your income tax are known as credits). If your purchases fall under the definitions of a deductible expense, than yes - you can deduct it from your taxable income (typically Schedule C, Section 179 and others). Depending on the expense, you will either take the entire amount for the year, or you will depreciate it over a period of time. When you go to sell it, if you make more money on it than you paid for it, than it's a gain - also reported on your Schedule C. If you lose money on it, the gain will generally be offset by the larger original investment. You are taxed on the NET gain. What you've described as double taxing is only happens if you don't declare the original expense. There's a lot more to it, so make sure to consult an accountant or tax attorney for your specific situation.
Re:1099's have been around for a long time (Score:3, Informative)
So, what you're saying is that you've been avoiding/evading paying taxes in the past? The requirement for 1099s for $600 or more has been around for a long time.
If you actually KNEW the law you would know that you only had to report for individuals who you paid more than $600 in a year. Not for companies (sole props, LLCs, or corporations).
This new regulation means that if you buy a $600 color laser printer from Office Depot you need to issue Office Depot a 1099 tracking that purchase. And if you buy gas at Costco for your travel to your clients you probably have to issue Costco a 1099 as well. McDonald's for the food you buy. United Airlines for the air tickets. NewEgg for the computer equipment. Apple for the two development iPads. And on and on...
Re:Well for starters (Score:4, Informative)
Re:1099's have been around for a long time (Score:1, Informative)
Re:Cue all the teabaggers blaming Obama... (Score:2, Informative)
* The record national debt run up by Smirky & Snarly
Which clearly is resolved by increasing the deficit by an order of magnitude...
The national/global economic crash caused by 8 years of complete republican control
I think Senator Tom Daschle [wikipedia.org] (D - SD), Senate majority leader from June 2001 through January 2004 would disagree. As would Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi [wikipedia.org] (D - CA, speaker of the house from Jan 2007 to the present) and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid [wikipedia.org] (D - NV, from Jan 2007 to present). In fact, it seems that of those "8 years of complete republican control" about half of them saw divided Government.
2 Unwinable wars in muslim nations for the benefit of the American multinational energy and military industrial complex corporations
Which, apparently, the current Administration has decided to ignore and escalate, simultaneously.
We now return you to your partisan rant...
Re:Well for starters (Score:3, Informative)
> ...then it's up to you to prove you paid enough not up to the IRS to prove
> you didn't.
That isn't true.
Re:it's worse than that (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Well for starters (Score:5, Informative)
IRS can't share the information with other agencies on its own, but other agencies can request the said information. You know, the FBI can subpena your tax return and IRS will have to give it to them. What IRS can't do, is take your tax return and share it with other agencies without such a subpena.
Re:Well for starters (Score:3, Informative)
> I am personally waiting for the IRS to start cracking down on drug dealers.
> there are billions in taxes that are waiting to be collected.
"Taxes"? They don't need no stinkin' taxes. If you get busted for drug dealing they will take all of your money.
Re:Cue all the teabaggers blaming Obama... (Score:4, Informative)
Most of the tea party people I know hate Bush only slightly less than Obama...
Having said that, the 2009 and 2010 deficits are almost 3 trillion dollars. The biggest deficit 2000-2008 was about $480 billion. So, while I believe that $480 billion dollar deficits are bad, $1.5 trillion is 3 times worse, and 2011 isn't going to be much better. The record debt under Bush looks very conservative compared to the actual 2009 and projected 2010-2012 budgets, and as usual the deficits are likely to be larger than the projections...
I hate all politicians and believe they all need to be dragged into the street and shot as traitors
That would be too good for them. I think stripping them of their power and assets and forcing them to get real jobs would probably be a fate worse than death for most of them.
I'll go slow (Score:3, Informative)
I'll use 20% as an example. You can substitute any number.
If your earnings are low enough that with 100% of your income you are *just* paying the rent and food and utilities, and then they apply 20% taxes, you're screwed.
If your earnings are high enough that you can pay all those things and you have 20% left, and then they apply a 20% tax, you're simply ok.
If your earnings are high enough that you can pay everything, go to Maui and Europe, and drive (and insure) a Lamborghini and have 80% left over, and they apply an 20% tax, you're not only ok, you're golden, as they say.
That - in short - demonstrates how "20%" means something different specifically depending upon your earnings.
Fair: Tax purchases, not income; don't tax necessities (generously figured as X dollars of food per person, X kilowatts per person, X gallons of water per person, X number of square feet per person, etc.) Every person gets X in certificates good for those tax debts, rather than the usual money. Like food stamps; but water stamps, real estate tax stamps, etc. These act like money, but only in the domain they are meant for - when submitted back to the IRS by the appropriate vendors. Tax every other purchase. At the other end, absolutely separate government spending from government income collection and distribution; and disallow operating at a deficit, period.
Re:it's worse than that (Score:2, Informative)
If you are going to Sam's club to buy items you use in your business, yes, you need to keep your receipts, so that you can show your expenses (used to offset revenue to determine income for tax purposes). If you are going to Sam's club to buy groceries and fertilizer for your lawn, that isn't a business purpose.
The only reason you might need to keep track of that $3 can of shaving cream is if your business is a full service barbershop that still does old-timey shaves.
In the meantime, most businesses that have regular dealings with suppliers have monthly invoices. Walk into store, buy whatever on company credit card/credit line, get summary at end of month. 12 items a year isn't much to track.
Re:it's worse than that (Score:3, Informative)
I agree that the system could be simpler, but for many people with simple incomes, it already is pretty dang simple (single 1040, maybe a 1099-INT for bank interest). It's when you have a large income and/or from many sources that it gets complex, and again, almost entirely due to tax breaks and reductions.
These people with "simple" incomes work for a corporation. When you work for yourself, calculating your income means tracking your gross income and deducting your costs. That's where a lot of the deductions come in. My wife is a therapist with a private practice working about 20 hours a week making a modest part time income. We still have to track all that crap.
Furthermore, even as someone with a "simple" income myself, various retirement plans (401K, IRA, Roth IRA), and college savings plans for my kids (529 plan, Educational IRA), and flexible spending accounts (childcare FSA, medical FSA) it gets complicated real quick. Do you know all the rules for putting money into your 401K? Your Roth? Conversion? Mandatory disbursement? Borrowing money from your 401K?
The tax code needs to die a painful death.
Re:it's worse than that (Score:4, Informative)
Am I supposed to now itemize EVERYTHING I spend? I try to do that now for business expenses, but now if I walk into Walmart to buy a $3.00 can of shaving cream because I ran out that morning mean I have to keep track of all that shit?
Only if you're claiming that can of shaving cream as a business expense. This law covers only those items you will claim as a business expense, which as you say above, you already keep track of. Items for personal use, regardless of how expensive, are not covered by these new reporting requirements. So, if you buy a $700 computer at Staples for your home business which you will claim as a deduction, you will now have to get Staples' taxpayer ID and fill in the paperwork. If you buy the same computer for your kids to do their schoolwork, you don't have to.
Re:it's worse than that (Score:2, Informative)
Re:and... (Score:4, Informative)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:US_incarceration_timeline-clean.svg [wikipedia.org]
it's a big business, and also helps the ongoing transition to a police state.
Not disproportionately (Score:2, Informative)
Actually, the current system is disproportionate. One person should pay the same tax rate as any other person, regardless of income. That would be proportionate. A higher income person paying 20% taxes would pay more taxes than a lower income person paying 20% taxes. Making him pay 30% is just robbery.
Re:Well for starters (Score:4, Informative)