Google Street View Logs Wi-Fi Networks, MAC Addresses 559
Posted
by
timothy
from the cannot-see-basements dept.
from the cannot-see-basements dept.
An anonymous reader points to this story at The Register that says "Google is collecting more than just images when they drive around for the Street View service. 'Google's roving Street View spycam may blur your face, but it's got your number. The Street View service is under fire in Germany for scanning private WLAN networks, and recording users' unique MAC (Media Access Control) addresses, as the car trundles along.' There's a choice quote at the end: 'Google CEO Eric Schmidt recently said Internet users shouldn't worry about privacy unless they have something to hide.'"
WLAN location triangulation (Score:5, Informative)
Google Maps provides WLAN-based location triangulation, on both phones and wi-fi capable computers. To do that, they look up the MAC addresses of visible wi-fi hotspots in a location database. Google is not the only company that does this via wardriving, and they at last have the sense to keep it secure enough that nobody can just look up your MAC address and get your geographic location. Unlike certain other wi-fi positioning systems. [wordpress.com]
Schmid (Score:5, Informative)
No, actually, he said that if you have $SOMETHING to hide then doing stuff concerned with $SOMETHING on t'internet is not a smart idea.
Re:Tell Your Wireless ... (Score:5, Informative)
Or in other words, "if you have something to hide, hide it". Privacy through obscurity is not an option on an indexed resource like t'internet.
Re:OK, I have something to hide... (Score:3, Informative)
OK, let me take the learned man's position
The learned man's position is to distrust what he is told by strangers, and check facts for himself.
You didn't do that.
Re:Ignorance abounds indeed (Score:3, Informative)
The privacy concern is that privacy concerners are fucking idiots like you.
ITS IN PUBLIC. ANYTHING IN PUBLIC IS, wait for it, PUBLIC!!!!!!!!!
It doesn't matter if you collect just one little bit of public information or you collect every single piece of public information. It's public. You have no right to expect privacy IN PUBLIC.
Schmidt is a Jackass! (Score:4, Informative)
He is hypocritical...
Check out the following article:
http://news.cnet.com/Google-balances-privacy,-reach/2100-1032_3-5787483.html?tag=nl [cnet.com]
Reaction from Google? CNET is barred one year from google.
http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/Google-Angry-at-CNET-66164 [dslreports.com]
Re:Tell Your Wireless ... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Tell Your Wireless ... (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Ignorance abounds indeed (Score:1, Informative)
Seriously: If you treasure the secrecy of your SSID so much, maybe you shouldn't broadcast it to your whole neighbourhood. Also, it's not like, you can actually do anything with that information.
Re:Very true here, but consider the place (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Tell Your Wireless ... (Score:4, Informative)
http://www.pcworld.com/article/184446/googles_schmidt_roasted_for_privacy_comments.html [pcworld.com]
Basically he's saying it's not as big a deal as everyone's making it out to be if they publish it on the Internet, because the US government is legally empowered to confiscate all of it without much due process.
Re:Tell Your Wireless ... (Score:3, Informative)
"If you have something that you don't want anyone to know, maybe you shouldn't be doing it in the first place, but if you really need that kind of privacy, the reality is that search engines including Google do retain this information for some time, and it's important, for example that we are all subject in the United States to the Patriot Act. It is possible that that information could be made available to the authorities."
Perhaps you can point out where in that he's saying "internet users shouldn't worry about privacy unless they have something to hide"?
Re:Tell Your Wireless ... (Score:5, Informative)
"If you have something that you don't want anyone to know, maybe you shouldn't be doing it in the first place, but if you really need that kind of privacy, the reality is that search engines including Google do retain this information for some time, and it's important, for example that we are all subject in the United States to the Patriot Act. It is possible that that information could be made available to the authorities."
That is the actual quote. I am pretending nothing.
Re:Tell Your Wireless ... (Score:5, Informative)
Except, you know, the quote given in the summary and article isn't what he said. What he actually said was "If you have something that you don't want anyone to know, maybe you shouldn't be doing it in the first place." To me, that's quite a bit different from the quoted "internet users shouldn't worry about privacy unless they have something to hide." At worst, I would take his actual quote to mean that trying to hide illegal and/or amoral acts is impossible in the internet age, at least if such acts are done on the internet.
Re:Very true here, but consider the place (Score:3, Informative)
It does appear it can be done in Germany. Skyhook's coverage map shows plenty of of access points in Germany for their service. I would expect that they aren't all user submitted and more a result of the wardriving efforts to map certain areas. I don't know if they needed to do something special like registering with the government to allow this.
Re:Schmidt is a Jackass! (Score:2, Informative)
> Reaction from Google? CNET is barred one year from google.
You infer this from a single line towards the end of the article.
If you'd care to visit your link, you'll see that the line has been crossed out.
Re:Ma Bell (the original) (Score:3, Informative)
In another ominous development, the phone company is planning to release a compiled document containing every name, address, and phone number of all their wired clients
Really? Where I live, you are asked when you sign up for the phone service whether you want to be in the telephone directory, and you may (by law) opt out if you wish.
Re:Origin of Privacy (Score:3, Informative)
yeah he didn't say that actually. in a nutshell, he said that in the age of the patriot act where the government can access any electronic record, if you are doing something illegal, you had better not be doing it in the internet.
Re:Tell Your Wireless ... (Score:5, Informative)
You are also misquoting him by omission. There is a comma at the end of the sentence - not a period. The whole quote is as follows:
I think his quote is entirely appropriate and not scary at all. If you are doing something and you don't want anyone to know about it, you should consider whether or not you ought to be doing it in the first place. That's almost Kant's categorical imperative; instead of "would I be okay if everyone else did this", it's "would I be okay if everyone knew I did this". Not quite as strong a basis for a moral system, but still something to consider.
If you decide that yes, you ought to be doing this but it should also be a secret, don't put it on the Internet. Nothing on the Internet is a secret. That's all he's saying.
Apple and the iPhone/iPod Touch already use this (Score:3, Informative)
http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1975 [apple.com]
"Location Services allows applications such as Maps, Camera, and Compass to use information from cellular, Wi-Fi1, and Global Positioning System (GPS)2 networks to determine your approximate location. This information is collected anonymously and in a form that does not personally identify you.
About location precision or accuracy
Depending on your device and available services, Location Services uses a combination of cellular, Wi-Fi, and GPS to determine your location. If you're not within a clear line of sight to GPS satellites, iPhone 3G and iPhone 3GS can determine your location using Wi-Fi3. If you're not in range of any Wi-Fi, iPhone can determine your location using cellular towers."
Do you know how they figure out your relative location via Wi-Fi? Yep...they've already got a map of transmitters in the wild to refer to, just like the map Google is building.