9 MA Cyberbullies Indicted For Causing Suicide 709
Raul654 writes "Massachusetts teenager Phoebe Prince committed suicide on January 14. After her death, it was revealed that she had been the target of cyberbullying for months (and that her teachers were aware of it and did nothing). Today, nine of her classmates were indicted on charges including harassment, stalking, civil rights violations, and statutory rape. Prince's suicide echoes the earlier case of Megan Meier, who committed suicide after being cyberbullied by a classmate's mother."
Re:Cyberbullies? (Score:1, Interesting)
While "cyberbullying" helps remove any responsibility for comments,as often seen on slashdot, and as seen on the memorial page, this does appear to be a full on asshole behavior. I do hope they throw the book at them, and at the school as well.
Re:Throw the book at them and the school. (Score:1, Interesting)
I think I'll home-school my kids....
Incidents at these levels are fairly isolated, but low level bullying is a part of life. Part of the reason to go to school is to learn how to deal with the idiots you will always have around you. It doesn't end with school, they exist in all areas of society, including the workplace. Office politics can be just a more cerebral version of the bullying.
This sends a terrible message to victims (Score:5, Interesting)
The authorities have made it plain by their actions that there's no way to get justice and stay alive. This is just going to make suicide look like a more attractive option to targets of bullying.
The problem also runs deeper than the conduct of the high school authorities. What are the odds that the conscienceless perpetrators didn't present any warning signs in grade school and middle school?
"Statutory Rape"? WTF? (Score:0, Interesting)
Why did the two boys get statutory rape charges thrown in? Did they actually do something, or is that a bullshit charge? If there's a reason for it, were the girls not involved, or shouldn't they have been charged with it as well?
Re:Your rights OFFLINE! (Score:2, Interesting)
The article is on topic. This incident is a follow up to the Lori Drew case that was previous covered on Slashdot. The slope has been greased up and we're sliding. Everything us liberty minded folks warned would happen as a result of the precedent set by that case is indeed happening.
bullying not entirely enigmatic (Score:5, Interesting)
People acting like assholes happens for actual reasons. Don't wave away the effort of figuring it out. That will just make you less able to cope.
Want insight? Here's a great starter: http://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/200910/big-bad-bully [psychologytoday.com]
Re:Her teachers were aware of it and did nothing.. (Score:5, Interesting)
You can look a little further and look for why you get spineless teachers and spineless administrators. Those with spine tend to get prosecuted when they attempt disciplinary actions by overzealous parents that most of the time won't do their part in their children's education, leaving all the burden to school.
Interesting paradox, isn't it?
This needs to be fixed (Score:5, Interesting)
But it won't be without a comprehensive solution. Simply kicking the bad kids out of school doesn't help, it requires the action of the parents as well, but frequently the parents have the "not my kid" or "it's not a big deal" attitude. And once you have to get the cops involved it's gone too far.
A big part of the problem is that the rewards for being a bully are simply too great, vs. any punishment a school can hand out.
On the other hand there is a fuzzy line between mostly harmless teasing (which learning to deal with builds character) and bullying, although in this case it was clearly so far over the line that there is no question.
What we don't need is yet another zero tolerance policy. As I stated above, there needs to be a comprehensive solution where the bad kids are held accountable in a material way, and the parents of the bad kids are likewise held responsible. At the same time, the victims need to be to learn that the bullies just don't matter. Unfortunately, society rewards the "cool" kids and punishes the dorks.
Probably the best current solution is teaching your kids how to beat the living shit out of a bully and to deal with the repercussions of that action.
I didn't have to deal with this too much when I was in school, probably had something to do with being 6'2" / 160 in 8th grade. It seems to me that most bullies grow up to be extroverted assholes selling cars - just desserts.
Re:Cyberbullies? (Score:4, Interesting)
The other unfortunate thing is that parent of so-called popular kids think that this kind of behavior is acceptable. Equally unfortunate is that unpopular kids do not feel empowered to do something to solve the mean-kid problem, up to talking to the ones parents. Tell them what is happening, and ask for help. Since their is a cyber element, that is documentation. Show it, report it. If administration want to protect the popular kids, escalate. For instance, I recall in elementary there were a couple kids who harassed everyone, the stupid 5th grade teacher could not believe that these christians could do this. By the end of the year it became obvious that these kids were playing her. This is almost a similar simplistic case in which adults clearly have documentation, but, clearly, the parents of the criminals refuse to do anything about it. Parent should have access to their kids communications, and failure to monitor and stop criminal activity makes them accomplices.
Kids do need to figure out how to interact with peers. However, when we as adults are victims of a crime, we do not usually solve the problems ourselves. We call in help. We do need to teach our kids to the same, and when there is documentation like a twitter message, to show in, and force adults to act on it. This is not snitching, this is civilized behavior. We see this with the current crop of right wing wackos. A video on you tube threatening and elected official has landed someone in jail. Kids need to learn this lesson as well, before they actual take the it to the level of physical assault.
I went through this kind of shit (Score:4, Interesting)
A couple of kids on the school bus decided they had it in for me. It was pretty constant physical harassment, 45 minutes each way, 5 days a week.
I was only 11 at the time and had no ability to deal with this on any level. I came home in tears every day. My mom called the school; my mom called the kids' parents; nothing changed.
After a couple of months, I basically said I wasn't riding the bus any more. That made it my mother's problem. She went to my father and made it his problem. My father went to the principal and made it the principal's problem. I don't know what the principal did. My guess is he called in the two kids and told them to stop it. After that, they restricted themselves to verbal harassment, which I could more or less deal with.
When one of my own kids was 10, he started reporting harassment at school. We had a few discussions with his teachers, but the harassment continued. So we pulled him from the town school and sent him to a nearby charter school for the duration of Junior High. He was not harassed at the charter school.
In our state, the per-pupil funding for a student follows the student when they go to a charter school. So for the next 4 years, I got occasional letters from the town school extolling the quality of their faculty and curriculum, asking me to respond to surveys, and even inviting me to attend focus groups (I am not making this up) that they were conducting to try to figure out what they needed to do to hold onto students (and their per-pupil funding).
I always responded to these, in writing, explaining exactly why we had pulled our son. I never received any response, let alone any indication that school might actually protect my children from harassment.
Even when their own funding is on the line, town schools are unable(?) unwilling(?) (take your pick) to protect students from harassment.
Re:Throw the book at them and the school. (Score:2, Interesting)
Had a similar instance will bullying with my son. It was all offline but during school and on the bus. Simple stuff, knocking his glasses off, taking his mp3 player, poking him in various places blah blah. When I spoke to the school about it, I was told there was nothing they could do other than mention it to the bus driver and possibly say something to the kids. Months later it was still going on. At my next meeting with the school I basically told them that this has gone on WAY too long and I instructed my son to fight back and sucker punch someone in the face if he had too not time someone takes something of his. At that point the principal stated that he would have to file a report about my intending to promote violence and if my son did "start" a fight, he would be expelled from school.
Long story short, he never had to resort to violence which was our real goal, my son was able to avoid being a target, and the jackass kids eventually grew out of it.
Don't rely on the school for help or for protection and don't think they are going to be the parent for you. There are a limitless amount of kids that bully in school, out of school, online, at the playground etc.., you CAN NOT stop them all, it will happen and is a fact of life. Take the responsibility as a parent and talk to your kids and find out what is bothering them and why and help them through it. Bullying is nothing new. IMHO, I think not giving small kids awards for winning and complimenting all kids all of the time because you don't want to offend one is fine for parents in a controlled environment and some what good for kids self esteem but kids do NOT treat other kids the same way outside of the parent controlled bubble. You are setting them up to fail but not letting them fail early on. Bring back dodgeball and "pick up" games at gym class and only give kids stars that deserve it. If you want to give every kid a star, find out what some kids are good at that others are not and give the stars are required. The kid who sucks at dodgeball might be good at math.
Re:Her teachers were aware of it and did nothing.. (Score:4, Interesting)
At least in our school district, the school adminstration has always met the problem head on. There was a Russian kid who got bullied, he filed a complaint. The administration took action, called the papers, set up school assemblies and had sessions for the kids. No news on kids who did it, but I guess that they got some serious counselling.
Something similar happened to my daughter; she's a jock and walks like a lumberjack. This kid has bigger arms than most boys her age. So some girls started to make fun of her; she took it to the administration and the behavior stopped immediately.
So not all districts are like that. Only the bad ones make the headlines.
Re:Cyberbullies? (Score:3, Interesting)
this guy [failblog.org], for one. Yeah, I shudder at just how big a dick somebody can be online too.
Re:Depends (Score:5, Interesting)
This kind of bullying is not just an issue in the US. I have lived and gone to school in three different countries and the same behaviour was on display in all three. This is just how kids act.
Re:Cyberbullies? (Score:1, Interesting)
Everyone seems to be assuming that these boys are part of the bullying since the article on it lumps it all together. Until I see something definitive otherwise, it looks like these are boys that she dated and may or may not have had sex with, but in any case, everyone involved appears to believe that she had sex with them(if you've been to high school you should know that who has and has not slept with who is something really, really difficult to get a true answer on). It sounds like, as a result of having sex with one or both of them, she aroused the ire of the actual bullies who drove her to kill herself. It's possible that one or both of the boys might have become involved in the bullying, or maybe simply in ruining her reputation, but I haven't seen anything suggesting it. Of course, these days, a sexually mature teenager having sex with another sexually mature teenager is still ardently pursued as a felony if they don't hit the strict, but arbitrary, age requirements. Never mind that such policies make at least 50 percent (and probably more) of people felonious sex criminals. Even if the actual reality is that these boys had consensual sex with her with no acrimony, no hard feelings, and they had nothing to do with the events that lead to her suicide, they are going to be punished far worse than the girls who actually hounded her to death and beyond.
If, on the other hand, the actual reality is that these boys had sex with her, then turned around and started harassing her along with the rest, then I suppose it's just desserts, although I still think the statutory rape is nonsense, but they should face the same punishment as the other miscreants. Another possibility is that these boys did not have sex with her, but went around saying they did, either maliciously, or just for the benefit of their reputations as idiot teenage boys (not to say that all teenage boys are idiots, just that those teenage boys who do that sort of thing clearly are idiots) sometimes will. If that's the case, the statutory rape charges are obviously even more ridiculous, but, once again, punish them along with the other miscreants for the slander and harassment.
Re:Your rights OFFLINE! (Score:2, Interesting)
Indeed. My son was having a fit, and I prevented him from running into the street (a busy highway in this case) as he is want to do in such circumstances.
I was arrested for felony assault of a child and spent four days in jail until I could bail myself out (having money, and getting it place when in jail are two different things), and told if I let him run into the street, I would have been charged with neglect and depraved indifference to human life.
I am still awaiting what, if any, formal charges will be laid.
Re:Your rights OFFLINE! (Score:2, Interesting)
Wrong answer. You don't lay hands on someone unless they are a direct threat/self-defense. Using physical violence as an adult upon a child as a way to stop bullying is just flat out fucking retarded. And really, "they heal quick!" are you fucking retarded?
Here's how you fix a bully: Shame them. Humiliate them. Make it clear to them - and most importantly, to them and EVERYONE they think looks up to them - just what a pathetic coward they actually are. And that can be done without actually laying hands on them. Try this one on for size:
Bigger adult goes up to bully, gets right in his face: "So you like picking on people who are smaller than you, huh? Well, how about you prove what a man you are by taking me on, right now? Get up, take a swing - let's see what that gets you, you pathetic child. Let's see if you're man enough to take a shot at me." If they start to threaten you or talk, say "Shut the fuck up and hit me, you little bitch!" I mean, really get in their fce and back them down, hard. When they inevitably back off - calling you crazy or saying that you're lucky they won't take a swing, follow it up, DEMAND that they take a shot at you. Don't let them off the hook. Make them back down, and when they do, explain to them exactly how they just demonstrated that they are a pathetic coward - explain it to them AND any of their cronies. Completely humiliate them.
Then explain how if their previous victim says they even looked at him funny you'll make damn sure they won't be able to do it again. Finally, tell them to get off the bus. I mean it - explain to them that they are no longer allowed to be in the same space as you and your friend.
You won't need to hit them, you'll completely humiliate them, and best of all you won't have to run the risk of going to jail for beating up a child. If they do swing at you - and they won't, but if they do - then it's self defense, and THEN it's justified.
I never said tell them nicely to stop doing it - I say give them a dose of the absolute terror that they try to instill in their victims. But you don't need to resort to violence to do it - that just reinforces the idea that might makes right and doesn't actually *scare* them. Make them scared - and believe me, the whole mind game of making them think you're going to tear them apart is much Much MUCH more terrifying than anything you'd actually physically do to them. In his mind you've just beaten the everloving shit out of him; in reality the worst you'd do is grab him by the collar and push him away/off the bus or whatever. One of those will stay with him for a long time, the other will make him realize that even if someone does fight back he isn't going to be hurt.
Re:Your rights OFFLINE! (Score:2, Interesting)
In the days before global instant communication
Such agitation
Was local in scope.
And there was the hope
It could all go away.
Now it remains and spreads
Increasing its threads
The audience is bigger
And that's the trigger
That makes them go away.
Re:Your rights OFFLINE! (Score:2, Interesting)
I understand your Darwinian point, and there's certainly an element of truth to it. The question is, how much do you value human life? You could, for example, send all your kids off to war, and indeed you will have "survival of the fittest." But you will also lose a lot of perfectly good future husbands and office workers, not to mention a lot of senseless, random deaths.
Kids do need to learn how to stick up for themselves, but in this case you had a 15-year-old who didn't know how. That's a failure of education. Nobody took her aside to explain that there was a legitimate (i.e. non-suicidal) way out.
There is also an element of gang assault here that is criminal. And it's completely inappropriate that 17-18 year olds were involved in this kind of immaturity.
There is two things that I think people are missing here, but I think the grandparent touched on. First Age means nothing, especially when you are trying to separate by one or two years.
There is no magic that happens when one turns 15, 16, 17, 18 etc. all that happens is you age another day. We all grow and change slowly, which is in part the reason that a company may prefer to hire a 30 something for a professional position, and a 20 something for retail type position. In other words, to me, it sounds like you are saying that what everyone else did was OK! but the 17 and 18 year olds should fry. They all should be punished, I don't know about locked up for life.
I cannot speak for others, but I had a pretty good idea of what was right and wrong before I was a teenager. That doesn't mean that I always chose to follow the right path. Part of being human is learning as we go, we all make mistakes, we all do dumb things.
I am not excusing this behavior in any way, on the contrary, I really blame the parents. I cannot blame the school officials, their hands are tied, god forbid these kids have any form of an authority figure in their lives. People say detention, suspension, expulsion. These people forget what it is like to be a kid, most dislike going to school, detention was usually fun, suspension was a vacation, expulsion meant you were going to another school next week.
I must admit, I am a huge fan of letting kids duke it out. That is the natural way of settling things, I was lucky enough to grow up at a time where fighting was allowed, however, frowned upon. I am not saying with weapons, I am saying with your fists.
Missed point #2, This could have easily been another Columbine, with lots of dead students and teachers, instead of just one. I should note that I put her parents equally to blame for her suicide as the harassing kids, they should have seen the warning signs, they should have been monitoring internet usage, most of all they should have been there for her. I see the job of a parent as that of someone who is there to help you pick up the pieces after you have fallen, not to prevent the fall in the first place. If you have kids, be there for them when they fall, be there to help them pick up the pieces, and know what is going on in their life so you can be prepared for the fall you can see coming.
Re:Your rights OFFLINE! (Score:2, Interesting)
You seem to think that the online world is a magical separate space where the things we write have absolutely no bearing on the rest of the world.
That impression is wrong. Threats are still threats, harassment is still harassment (and, for that matter, libel is still libel, agreements are still agreements, etc.) Cyberspace is not "reality 2.0." The internet is a communication media that is part of the same real world where we have laws against threats, libel, harassment, assault (note nothing is said about battery) and the like.
Re:Your rights OFFLINE! (Score:0, Interesting)
You really don't understand bullying at all.
WAS a bully as a kid.
As an adult, I am now a teacher, and one of the things I teach kids (and other teachers) is how to deal with bullying
First of all, the real bully is NOT the one harassing this kid. The real bully is the kid pulling the strings to get the group to harass this kid.
You were right about teaching this kid some basic social skills. Any time you have a kid that's being bullied, they are missing some basic social skills (gets more complex in HS, but still applies).
By keeping kids inside, never letting them out, and the whole 'play date' nonsense, we deprive kids of the opportunity to make friends and learn social skills. The more we do this, the more bullies we will see, because the more victims we create.
Yes, I am putting blame on those being bullied, and more specifically, the parents of these kids. If you don't accept that these kids are not socially equipped to deal with these situations, you will never fix the problem. Look for it early. If your 2nd grader is getting bullied, teach your kids social skills. If you can't teach these skills, get someonme else to help you.
Re:Your rights OFFLINE! (Score:3, Interesting)
A teacher of mine told a nice story about a wheelchair-bound friend of hers. The man was occasionally bullied by idiots (not quite kids anymore) and more than once did he do a little "trick" to such people. He said something like "come on, stop that, I dare you to shake my hand". At that point bullying idiots began to hesitate and he could ask how they could be too scared to shake his hand or if they did shake it, he could squeeze their until they screamed. Since he was in a wheelchair and had to use his hands much more than most people, he had really strong muscles. Any "main bully" that was scared of shaking his hand or cried and screamed if they did, didn't get much respect by his followers anymore. And instead, the followers were quite impressed with how strong the man was despite sitting in a wheelchair.
Re:Your rights OFFLINE! (Score:4, Interesting)
Having had enough this ongoing saga, I stood up and rather loudly shouted while staring them both down "You two shut up, else I'm going to beat the shit out of BOTH of you!". Looking back, this clearly must have looked comical. One kid half the size of these two older kids threatening them, yet the effect itself was what made this stick with me.
The rest of the bus went silent for a split second, then literally BURST out into both laughter and applause. Result? Amazingly the two kids in the main argument both sat down, shut up and remained quiet for the rest of the trip to the train station.
Sometimes even the perceived threat (however unlikely - a twelve year old kid beating up TWO fifteen year old kids heheh) is enough to stop a tirade.
Since then, I have never been afraid to step in when I see a kid getting picked on if they are outnumbered and clearly have their tail between their legs so to speak.
Re:Your rights OFFLINE! (Score:1, Interesting)
These were my thoughts. Cyberbullying is everywhere. I have way too much training in IT, cryptography, electronics. As I sit here, I have paper staring at me from several universities and several colleges. I'm not much of a 'dirty deeds done dirt cheap' kind, but the kids that tormented this girl (and maybe their parents too) look like they could use a healthy dose of somewhere in between '50 toilets delivered from Sears, with restocking charges' to 'The Chicago branch of La Casa Nostra Spotted your IP address or cell phone number along with their missing $20000000. They are pissed and they want it back NOW!'
Re:Her teachers were aware of it and did nothing.. (Score:1, Interesting)
Another Eastern European here, and I concur what Parent said. Bullying may have been a problem in 1st grade when you barely know where your classroom was, but after that it was not a big problem.
One part of the answer why it was different in Eastern Europe is because the teachers (used to) have authority. It was unheard of to disrupt class, talk back, or, God forbid, fight with a teacher. In most cases the parents would be doing the physical penalty, even if the school only dings a point off your "behavior" number. But then again, parents also had authority back in the days.
Of course, the mass pussification is slowly taking hold of Europe as well...
Shouldn't it be easy to teach the bullies? (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Your rights OFFLINE! (Score:3, Interesting)
That's the strange thing about school. As an adult, if another adult threatens you with violence or intimidation, you respond by appealing to another authority authorized to use more violence (i.e., the police). But somehow, it's cultural for kids to be told not to "tell", and to "solve their own problems." Another option you have as an adult is to move jobs or take a different route to work, which you don't have as a high-schooler. The fact is that high school is screwed up, both culturally and structurally, and is socially a poor preparation for the "real world".
Re:Her teachers were aware of it and did nothing.. (Score:3, Interesting)