Facebook Sued Over Data Access 73
Late last year, a web service called Power.com launched with the aim of allowing users to unify their use of multiple social networks. Facebook quickly filed a lawsuit, objecting to the (user-authorized) gathering of their data. Reader sufijazz writes with news that Power.com has now countersued Facebook, saying, "Facebook improperly restricts its users' access to their private information," and that Facebook's own data scraping makes their lawsuit an attempt to stifle competition. According to TechCrunch,
"Facebook can point to its efforts with Facebook Connect, which lets you log in with your Facebook username at third party sites and import some select data from your profile, as evidence of its openness. But this isn't true data portability, it's just a new walled garden — third parties are generally only allowed to cache your data, which means that you're still tethered to Facebook."
Re:Well (Score:5, Insightful)
I think this has more to do with you wanting to move your data, not them just handing it out. There is a huge difference.
This example is more related to you going to a hospital and requesting your health records be transferred to another hospital and they say no. Don't get it confused with privacy/security.
Re:Really? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Really? (Score:2, Insightful)
Technically true, but really ... (Score:5, Insightful)
Yeah, technically they're withholding your data from a third party even after your authorization. But if you consider the vast majority of Facebook users, don't you think most of them need this kind of hand-holding? These are people who would authorize a complete disclosure of most of their personal information on Facebook to take a "Which Twilight Character Are You?" quiz. If anything, I think Facebook should be even more stingy, even if you choose to authorize disclosure. If you really really really really really wanted to give a third party your personal information, then you can usually do so yourself, without the third party acquiring that information through Facebook.
Now, I don't know how power.com works, nor did I RTFA, but I assume it requires certain information from Facebook that is not really yours. Information such as links to your profile, your friends' profiles, pictures, groups, what-have-you. Such information is probably strictly Facebook's property. Without such information, power.com would be useless anyway.
At any rate, as I said, if you really wanted to give your personal information to a third party, you can do so without the help of Facebook. Facebook's stinginess at releasing personal information is a good thing, and I think they should go even further in their stinginess. Personal information sometimes isn't removed from third party apps even after removal of the app, and I think Facebook should start using the ban hammer on apps and developers who keep personal information even after deauthorization. I think such stinginess can only be a good thing, until they start withholding your personal information from you directly.
Re:Technically true, but really ... (Score:3, Insightful)
I would love the fact if Facebook was being stingy with my information to advertisers, but they're not. Or what if I could select what information to send to applications, instead of the all or nothing approach. It sucks when they're only stingy with their users not their customers (aka their advertisers).
I'm nonplussed, when it's Microsoft we're all for interoperability. When it's Apple, Google or Facebook it's alright not to give users their rights. I guess I missed the memo.
~~~
Abraham Lincoln "Stand with anyone that is right; stand with him while he is right and part with him when he goes wrong."
--Abe Lincoln
This is handwaving (Score:5, Insightful)
"Facebook improperly restricts its users' access to their private information,"
Huh, what? You entered the data in your profile. Naturally, you have the data, at least, if you chose to keep a copy of it.
Facebook.com's terms of service don't contain any clause or term of use where they guarantee they will provide you any data you have entered for free access by any third party application or service.
This is as if you published a book on an online website, and a third-party decides to sue the website, because you signed up with a third-party, giving the third-party permission to reprint, but your book-publishing website chooses not to cooperate.
Just because the information is yours, doesn't mean you have a right to authorize someone to scrape it from an online service you have posted it to. That online service has an interest and a right to control the terms and conditions under which their servers may be accessed.
Re:Technically true, but really ... (Score:3, Insightful)
I think this lawsuit is good, because then the court can decide what is yours and what isn't.
Yes, since the national government has a long history of supporting individual privacy and keeping our best interests at mind over that of corporate interests.
Comment removed (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Really? (Score:2, Insightful)
You have full rights to your data, of course they are under no obligation to provide you a copy of all your data. Unless you live in a jurisdiction that has privacy laws that require they provide all personally identifiable information for your inspection and correction.
You can login to facebook, using your username and password, and see all your data, however. I would say that they give you ample access to it.
What they don't let you do is utilize their service to export all your data directly to other services. You would have to copy and paste or type/write your data down by hand manually for import into other services.
Or you could just keep the authoritative copy of your data in notepad, periodically update, and paste your updated data into all the social networking websites you want to post it on.
Re:Technically true, but really ... (Score:2, Insightful)
Also this is corporate interest versus corporate interest, not citizens against Facebook. It would be nice to see the EFF or ACLU get involved.
Re:Really? (Score:2, Insightful)
They're well within their rights to stop automated attempts to scrape content and pursue actions against people who partake in tortious interference. Where a third-party site specifically encourages Facebook users to violate the ToS agreement by providing username and password credentials users are forbidden from disclosing.
Matters would be very different if it was just users scraping their own profile page for their persoanl use, in a non-disruptive and undetectable manner.
Or if the third party just developed a small tool you could download and use to scrape your profile info from FB (without violating the ToS and sending usernames+passwords to them).
However, a third party connecting directly to FB and performing mass scraping activities is eminently detectable, disruptive, a ToS violation, and basically steals services (users of the scraping service do not see FB advertising, for instance).
Re:Really? (Score:2, Insightful)
Do I have the right to access the data of my friends? That is the heart of the matter. I don't care about my data, I already have it.
Call me a curmudgeon... (Score:3, Insightful)
Please cite for me an actual benefit of having a Facebook account?
Otherwise - GET OFF MY LAWN!
Re:Really? (Score:2, Insightful)
You have a right to access data of your friends that they allow you to access and that Facebook allows you to access, in the manner that they choose to permit that access.
Much like you have a right to see this comment response on slashdot in response to yours.
If slashdot so chose, they could decline to accept it, and decline to grant you the right to see it.
Just like FB could decline you the right to see a copy of a friend's profile page.
But FB doesn't, they give you the ability to view your friend's pages.
They just don't give you the right to make a web site that connects to the FB servers and spider's a user's friends pages.
FB has a right to dictate the manner in which you may access their servers. They can mandate that you use IE 6 if they so desire, it's their playground.
There are other ways you can get your friends' info that don't have the encumberance of any restrictions FB might impose, for example, you can ask your friends for the info.
Re:Call me a curmudgeon... (Score:1, Insightful)
online phone book for when you format your computer, but forget to backup your contact's list.
other than that... it's just another pointless social page
Re:This is handwaving (Score:2, Insightful)
Ignoring the fact that all the pictures are downsized and not the original pictures you would want.
who honestly uploads files to facebook as a means of storage? It's not the purpose of the site.
Re:Call me a curmudgeon... (Score:3, Insightful)
You can keep track of long lost friends.
In my case, I changed city about 6 times, and changed school about 5 times. (no, I wasn't raised in a circus) So there is a lot of people that I knew but lost track of.
I joined Facebook some weeks ago and now I have about 50 "recovered friends", that is, people that used to be my friends but then I lost touch. I chatted with some, said happy birthday to others, etc.
It would have been more difficult finding them without facebook, since finding each friend manually would be a PITA, and also very non-casual. I mean, how do you get in touch with a kindergarden friend? You don't just call him and tell him "hey, I noticed your name was on the phone book and so I called to say hi". Instead, requesting to "become friend" over facebook is something casual.
Once you get in touch you can just write silly things like "I hate this TV host" or "Today I feel sad". Or you can post old photos or whatever. That gives your friends a chance to see what you are up to and maybe start an actual conversation or schedule a real life encounter (want to come to my birthday this saturday?) And since you are broadcasting to everybody you don't put anyone in particular in the position of having to answer.
It is similar to an msn account, only that you can just broadcast whatever you want and wait to see if somebody answers. Just like bloging, but directed to people you kind-of-know.
I think having an open standard to such service would be great, just as it would be great to have an open standard to IM, and just as it is great to have an open standard to email. Maybe Wave will change this in the near future. I think of this as a way of taking my friends with me wherever I go.
The advantage of facebook is that they have a huge database of "name"->"email" entries, so once you sign up you find out hundreds of people you know. In part, their success is due to spamish practices like sending invitations to all your IM or email contacts (at your request).
There are probably other uses, but this is one I can think of.
Re:This is handwaving (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Call me a curmudgeon... (Score:2, Insightful)
^That right there is why I will never get a facebook account. If I want people I used to know and associate with to make contact with me just so we can renew and some fake pseudo-online friendship. Hell, I they might be people I moved to get away from.
People I actually care about, I stay in touch with and have contact information, I don't need facebook for that. But hey, if you like/want that, more power to you.
Comment removed (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Technically true, but really ... (Score:4, Insightful)
If you're my friend, that's a fact about me. Why should Facebook own that fact?
Re:Well (Score:3, Insightful)
Whoosh. GPs point is that data SHOULD be moveable, same as yours.