British Airport Will Require Fingerprints From Domestic Passengers

ProfBooty brings us a story about England's Heathrow airport, which will begin fingerprinting passengers on its domestic flights later this month. Airport executives claim that the data will be stored for no longer than 24 hours, and will not be shared with law enforcement. We've previously discussed airport fingerprinting measures in the United States and Japan. Quoting: "All four million domestic passengers who will pass through Terminal 5 annually after it opens on March 27 will have four fingerprints taken, as well as being photographed, when they check in. To ensure the passenger boarding the aircraft is the same person, the fingerprinting process will be repeated just before they board the aircraft and the photograph will be compared with their face. Dr Gus Hosein, of the London School of Economics, an expert on the impact on technology on civil liberties, is one of the scheme's strongest critics. He said: 'There is no other country in the world that requires passengers travelling on internal flights to be fingerprinted. BAA says the fingerprint data will be destroyed, but the records of who has travelled within the country will not be, and it will provide a rich source of data for the police and intelligence agencies.'"

So what's the point?

[sqrt(2)]

data will be stored for no longer than 24 hours, and will not be shared with law enforcement.

Then why are you doing it? It seems like they're just trying to get the citizens used to these kinds of abuses so that when they do start cross-checking and retaining data indefinitely nobody will be able to tell the difference, or care.

And Oceania has always been at war with Eurasia.

defective by design indeed ...

[siddesu]

"The company said the move had been necessitated by the design of Terminal 5, where international and domestic passengers share the same lounges and public areas after they have checked in. "

Nothing to add here.

It's already started

[g_hill]

They're not waiting for Terminal 5, I was photographed and fingerprinted like a criminal today on my way home from a meeting in Hamburg, via Heathrow Terminal 1. I wasn't happy, why should I as a UK passport holder have my fingerprints taken? It's a police state.

Not too expansive

[dedeman]

Luckily, the country isn't so large that other forms of travel are not feasible.

Not like in the US, where if you're in NY, trying to go to LA (or other destinations west), air travel is one of the few options available.

I'm starting to wonder if there's some running joke, or competition, between lawmakers/politicians in the US and UK, seeing who can come up with the most idiotic, errrr I mean, essential to safety and liberty, stresses on freedom. Or maybe they're angling for the population to revolt.

Either way, laws like this win. If you follow them, you'll be safe, and so we must maintain them, because to maintain freedom and safety, we must be EVER VIGILANT. If they are broken, or cause civil unrest, they are justified in their creation, because look how many people there will be who want to wreak havoc on safety and order.

I never fly, unless absolutely necessary. If they want to make poorly thought regulation part of the new safety routine, I don't involve myself.

Re:WTF.

[necro2607]

That "terrorist act" is just used as an excuse/"reason" for them to come down hard on our freedoms and do whatever they feel like doing, in the name of "safety" and "security".. That's it. Just a bullshit excuse for raping the shit out of ordinary peoples' freedoms and liberties.

This scenario of them fingerprinting for domestic flights is a GREAT WAY to desensitize people to such "security measures", so they can take it yet another step further a little while into the future.

As usual, it's a slippery-as-hell slope, and it doesn't seem like people are really standing up against it. Yeah, we rant and bitch online but... like that does a damned thing.

Man, all it does is fill me with such animosity and pessemism. I just feel pissed off. My outlook is constantly degraded and made to be more negative, every day, due to this kind of messed up crap happening. Don't even know what else to say, I just hate it so much.

Re:WTF.

[megaditto]

But I still don't think that answers GP's question: why is this happening now instead of back when IRA blew up bomb and killed people pretty much weekly?

Is it the teletubbies instilling their gay agenda into the young minds? All the mercury in marmite rotting their brains? The hot East-European chicks infecting the populate with the highly contageous BendOverForAuthoritis?

Why are Britons turning into a bunch of craven pussy chickenshits (for lack of a better word)?

More security is better, right ?

[billcopc]

Since all the previous airport hassles have FAILED at improving security, they need to resort to even more random bullshit.

Let's face it: there is no methodical screening process that can properly account for the fact that people hate your country. This has nothing to do with terrorism, at least not the kind that the WTC was blamed on. Hell, if I were pissed off enough and just happened to have the resources to blow shit up, I would be somewhat tempted to raise hell in Washington or Buckingham or any other fucked up nation. That's the kind of anger these totalitarian regimes trigger within my gut. It feels fundamentally wrong and people get extreme reactions.

I say reverse the trend, make the airlines normal again as they were in the 80s and 90s. Who cares if people are "smuggling" drugs, or if someone just happens to be second cousin once removed to the groundskeeper of a member of the Bin Laden family ? Who really fucking cares ? They're on a plane, and they're travelling. If the US Government hadn't been shitting on Iraq for the last two decades, maybe those folks wouldn't be so angry in the first place. Then again, maybe someone would have detonated the WTC anyway just to instigate this mess, it has been the single most powerful event of this decade, and its effects are still expanding six years later with no loss of momentum.

The way I see it, if this keeps up, soon enough it's going to be USA vs everyone else in the world. For every force, there is an equal and opposite force. Americans don't want that, and the world doesn't want that, but keep shoving people around and eventually the nukes will fly.

Re:A list of airports like this?

[Wuhao]

So, does a site exist where I can see which airports / countries are going to invade my civil rights?

Having traveled a bit, I feel confident saying that Wikipedia's worldwide list of airports [wikipedia.org] is what you're looking for.

Re:So what's the point?

[Admiral Ag]

Since it doesn't seem to matter who you vote for in Britain, it appears that the only way to stop crap like this would be active forms of civil disobedience, which the authorities would then point to to justify what was being protested against in the first place. Joseph Heller would be proud.

Re:WTF.

[ZDRuX]

But I still don't think that answers GP's question: why is this happening now instead of back when IRA blew up bomb and killed people pretty much weekly?

Because people wouldn't put up with it back then. The government needed a catalyst for propell this Orwellian state onto people. 9/11 did the job quite nicely. If you look closely, all this "total control" has been creeping into our lives quite slowly over the last 50 years, but it really accelerated after 9/11.

If the U.S./UK governments are responsible for 9/11 is beyond the scope of this reply, but you at least have to marvell at the inguinity of it all, and how it all seemleslly fell into place. Problem-Reaction-Solution, the rest is up to you to figure out people. That is all.

Another country

[Slisochies]

Another country to add to my list of places not to visit...

Re:The Point is ...

[rucs_hack]

I had my first ever taste of domestic UK flight last year.

I was rather annoyed by the whole 'ZOMGH! Your kid is carrying half bottle of flavoured water!' that the couple in front of me went through, followed by a bag search as a reward for their kid being, well, a kid.... They were hugely embarrassed. I mean, what the bleep is up with that?
I found the whole 'you are suspicious because you are flying with us today' thing irritating.

Since then I've taken trains. It takes longer for some journeys, but its a lot less hassle.

Re:So what's the point?

[Z00L00K]

Some identity papers are better than other. It's very easy to mix up people from areas of the world where those matters are of lesser concern or where the identity papers aren't easily convertible to western standards.

And just because A and B has a great similarity to their identities and papers doesn't necessarily mean that B is using forged identity papers of A. There may have been a mixup somewhere else.

And even if B is used A:s forged papers, who is the terrorist? A may still be the terrorist and B may just be an illegal immigrant that tries to stay afloat. The rest is collateral damage...

Illegal immigrants in general are just trying to get a better life, get out from daily bashing or even survive to live the next day. Sometimes it's necessary to get forged papers to get where you want.

And from a realistic perspective - being an illegal immigrant is unpractical if you are going to perform a terrorist action. It introduces a greater risk getting the plans messed up. Coming in as a student, tourist or a businessman is certainly a much easier way to slip through the net.

But of course - when you are on your final leg of your action it may be useful to use fake identities just to make things harder to wrap up for the authorities. The catch is that using such identities can cause problems if they are detected.

Re:WTF.

[Anne Thwacks]

Ever since some wackos killed less people than die from AIDS in a day the US,

Actually, AIDS doesnt kill a lot of people in the UK. However, armed police have killed more people in the last five years than terrorists have, and our police are not routinely armed.

The government ARE the terrorists.

Re:So what's the point?

[Cederic]

When I go to the US my details are taken, my fingerprints, photos, credit card numbers that were used to book the flight, which hotel I'm staying at, departure date, hire car details.

So don't go.

And stop flying through Heathrow. Refuse to let them take your fingerprints.

It doesn't take many people to start making this stand and the airlines and airports will start complaining to the Government about their reduced revenue.

No civil disobedience required, just a small amount of personal sacrifice. Or are you personally selling out while decrying the rest of us for doing so?

Re:WTF.

[Anonymous Coward]

"What is next? Retinal scans and Blood samples?"

Hey, you know what? I'd MUCH prefer a retinal scan. They can have that and file it forever for all I care. You know why? Because unlike fingerprints I'm not leaving imprints of my retina all over the place as I travel from place to place -- fingerprints that might mistakenly be confused with someone who is a criminal, or which might be left at a location that subsequently turns out to be the scene of a crime. Whenever I think about turning over my fingerprints to the government I think of the case of Brandon Mayfield [wikipedia.org], whose fingerprints were mistakenly identified on the equipment used in the Madrid bombings, and who spent 2 weeks in jail as a result. I don't have any criminal record, but I don't want my fingerprint in a database where it can yield a false positive.

As far as I know, it isn't possible to reliably read a retinal image from my eye without my knowledge, and therefore its use is pretty much restricted to only what it should be -- for verifying my identity when necessary and in circumstances that I am fully informed about.

It will matter a lot come the next election

[Kupfernigk]

The Lib Dems may well hold the balance, and they dissent from the major parties on this issue. They also have a few heavyweights who know how the world works and are critical of it - Vince Cable is a former chief economist of Shell, no less, and has just delivered a speech attacking the failure to tax rich immigrants.