EU Plans to Require Biometrics for Visitors 238
bushwhacker2000 writes to tell us that the EU may soon be requiring travelers to provide biometric data before crossing into Europe. They are trying to soften the blow by offering "streamlined" services for frequent travelers but the end result seems the same. "The proposals, contained in draft documents examined by the International Herald Tribune and scheduled to go to the European Commission on Wednesday, were designed to bring the EU visa regime into line with a new era in which passports include biometric data. The commission, the EU executive, argues that migratory pressure, organized crime and terrorism are obvious challenges to the Union and that the bloc's border and visa policy needs to be brought up to date."
Is the data stored on the passport? (Score:2, Interesting)
Of course, the human element on the manual checks will likely be the easiest to defeat, as it usually is.
Copyright vs Security (Score:2, Interesting)
The USA wants a LOT more from the EU (Score:2, Interesting)
perhaps we shall goto China or Russia this year, none of this fingerprint and eye photo crap at the US border and as a bonus we get treated like guests not criminals
so say goodbye to the US tourism industry RIP 2008
The US administration is pressing the 27 governments of the European Union to sign up for a range of new security measures for transatlantic travel, including allowing armed guards on all flights from Europe to America by US airlines.
The demand to put armed air marshals on to the flights is part of a travel clampdown by the Bush administration that officials in Brussels described as "blackmail" and "troublesome", and could see west Europeans and Britons required to have US visas if their governments balk at Washington's requirements.
According to a US document being circulated for signature in European capitals, EU states would also need to supply personal data on all air passengers overflying but not landing in the US in order to gain or retain visa-free travel to America, senior EU officials said.
And within months the US department of homeland security is to impose a new permit system for Europeans flying to the US, compelling all travellers to apply online for permission to enter the country before booking or buying a ticket, a procedure that will take several days.
The data from the US's new electronic transport authorisation system is to be combined with extensive personal passenger details already being provided by EU countries to the US for the "profiling" of potential terrorists and assessment of other security risks.
thanks but ill stay at home and advise people not to visit the US on business or pleasure.
mission accomplished.
A golden era of travel is coming to an end :-( (Score:5, Interesting)
I've just arrived in Japan, which has - following pressure from the US - introduced fingerprinting at the border for all foreigners (including those with residence rights, not just visitors). While the process was relatively smooth (put your index fingers on a little machine), it's been my first contact with the world of paranoid "anti-terrorist" biometrics and for me marks the end of an era where international travel has been an expression of freedom.
Re:Falls rome, falls the world (Score:3, Interesting)
Oh, that's ripe! You're suggesting that the USA has clean hands, never supported or installed tyrants and corporatists, that Prescott Bush and his cronies didn't fund the Nazi war machine, that IBM had nothing to do with the Holocaust, that Operation Paperclip was just a liberation, that the fascists who attempted a coup on FDR met justice and were punished (look up Smedley Butler).
One of the most disappointing things about America the Brave, the Beautiful, is the perverse revisionist history that its patriotism requires.
Is this really practical? (Score:2, Interesting)
Biometrics sounds like a good idea, but I can never justify the single point of failure involved with it. It seems like it would be very easy to get false negetives.
I use usb keys to authenticate on my desktops, and if a key were ever to fail, i have a backup in the safe. The key responds to the encryption keys stored on the flash disk, and uses the serial number of the device as an added protection against copying. This is a simple setup of pam_usb and udev.
I do woodworking as a hobby, and occasionally cook. It's not uncommon to cut/burn a finger. Also with they usb keys I only have two, one on my key ring, and one in a safe. I don't leave my keys or my passwords lying around, but compare that to your fingerprint. How many places do you leave your fingerprint throughout a day? A google search, $20, and a trip to the hardware store is all you need to lift a print.
I hear a lot of people promote biometrics as a huge breakthrough in security, but I just don't see how it can be practical.
Just my $0.02
Re:It's America's fault (Score:2, Interesting)
We (from the EU) should have risen above this stupidity - but obviously we haven't.
An eye for an eye, in this case leaves everyone carrying ridiculous amounts of documentation (or maybe just staying at home).
Re:Hmm (Score:2, Interesting)
I loved my trip to U.S.A. and would like to return there in the near future, but it really spoils the experience when i'm treated like a criminal who has to answer a form with such ridiculous question as "Are you making your trip with any intent of committing a crime in the United States?" or "Do you carry any illegal substances?" kind of questions.WTF??
Don't get me wrong though, it's not just TSA guys that like to annoy people our customs guys are annoying too, but we don't make such a fuss about it, perhaps wrongfully.
PS: If you were in charge what would you choose? Security or convenience?
Re:Hmm (Score:4, Interesting)
I think that a lot of people (myself included) who have problems with these "intrusive programs" aren't dealing with the realities of the situations that they are implemented to deal with. We're all worried about these frightful "what if" scenarios. We don't realize that there are some situations in which "intrusive" tactics are required. For example I do some community service in Long Beach, CA. The place where I do community service is a "very bad" neighborhood. The police are actively doing what they can to deal with the problems (drug dealing, auto burglaries, gang intimidation, etc.) Part of what the police do is they stop anybody who they see riding around on bikes. They stop the people to figure out who they are and what they are doing in the neighborhood. On one hand, doing so is probably a violation of some "inherent rights." On the other hand, the police are doing what they need to do to reduce the number of convincted criminals running around the neighborhood.
I don't really buy into the whole War on Terror crap that is being shoved down our throats because I am well read enough and educated enough to realize that our government created al Qaeda and our government actively supports governments that oppress their people to the point where they become "terrorists." So although "terrorist" might not be a good label to put on freedom fighters actively resisting the new world order, the label definitely does fit some organizations that are terrorizing communities right now, right here in the United States. Organizations like MS13, the Mexican mafia, etc.
Comment removed (Score:3, Interesting)
European Eunion? (Score:4, Interesting)
for those who automatically say migrants are bad (Score:5, Interesting)
Some people say immigration is bad because it takes jobs away from the the natives. Migration control programmes such as those discussed are very often fuelled by such fears.
In a healthy free market economy, jobs are held by those who can contribute more to the economy for the least cost. It has been my observation that some people, once achieving some comfortable and secure lifestyle, stop innovating and become lazy sluggards, who, even if they spend 8-10 or more hours "at work", they produce little or no real tangible economic value. PHBs are a good example: While the economic contribution of a good manager is to provide sound planning and organisational design, PHBs merely walk around the office carrying a cup of tea, literally doing nothing. In theory, their contribution could become visible someday in a department or company crisis when a decision would be crucial, but my experience tells me that most PHBs would be unable to respond to any crisis in any intelligent way, and most of them stay employed thanks to connections and nepotism. The end result for the economy is great waste, inefficiency, lack of skills, and the development of a passive approach to life which hinders entrepreneurship, initiative, and innovation.
In such an economy, where a great number of people have learnt to live their life without earning it with their ability, thanks to nepotism, status, various social structures, etc, the appearance of a few migrants can have positive effects from an economic point of view: Migrants come, some of them having useful skills, and they renovate the economy. When employers notice that the migrants have real skills and are willing to work for lower wages, they will eventually fire the lazy sluggards and force them to take a more active approach to life and learn new skills, ie to become again actively useful in the economy. In this way, migrants help counterbalance the tendency of many humans to stop innovating once they achieve some security.
Knowing this, a certain number of migrants is not only tolerable but in fact should be highly wanted and desirable, as they have a legitimate and useful economic role to play in our economies (to wake up our lazy fellows). And it is not only highly educated migrants that should be in demand: Migrants with low education should be welcome as well, as they often help to fill gaps in an economy whose members increasingly move towards the service sector and higher-paying jobs.
There are, of course, some dangers from the influx of huge numbers of migrants. One danger is sociological and has its basis in animal behaviour: You can see that, for example, ants are aggressive towards ants from different colonies. Similarly, humans in general do have some passive aggressiveness hidden somewhere in their mind towards persons from different nations. There is, of course, some biological basis for this, as it helps teams of humans (tribes) secure resources and maintain family lineages. But in the modern era, with our developed economies and globalised communications, we need not worry so much about these concerns that belong to the prehistory eras. What we should do is to take care to not allow this passive subconscious aggressiveness become an activated state of mind and infect the conscious mind. This can happen to most people, without them realising it, when great numbers of migrants come into a country and interact with the locals. Seeing one migrant does not raise xenophobic tendencies, but suddenly seeing a thousand migrants out of your door may cause your subconscious tribal feelings to be activated and projected to the consciousness in a variety of ways (xenophobia, racism, economic protectionism, security paranoia, etc). When this happens to the majority of a native population, the results can be disastrous. We have seen it in history and such mistakes should not be repeated by civilised people.
So, how can we ensure that immigration results in positive economic contributions without triggering sociological problems?
Re:A golden era of travel is coming to an end :-( (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Hmm (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:The level of paranoia is growing exponentially (Score:2, Interesting)
Really? I actually hear racist comments very often. Like my dutch teacher who said that every muslim was a radical. Like newspaper stories telling about how unfortunate it is not to be able to arrest some orthodox muslims because they haven't committed any crime yet.
There are whole political parties in Belgium and the Netherlands defending the right to discriminate people. Not on the contents of their characther, but on the color of their skin. Mark Rutte, top man of the dutch VVD, was condemned for racism while he was a government minister some ? 3 years ago. He had **officially** told police to focus investigations on **legal** somali residents of the Netherlands because they were more likely to commit crime. When he lost, the guy did say that the law that forbid him from giving such an order such be changed. This is the top man of the "3rd or something like that" party in the Netherlands.
You got to be really blind and deaf to claim there is no such a thing as racism in Europe nowadays.
Did you know that small children feel that when they break eye contact something stops existing? That's why they close their eyes when they are afraid. I guess you hope that if you close your eyes hard enough, the everyday racism and xenophoby will simply cease to exist.
Re:The USA wants a LOT more from the EU (Score:3, Interesting)
Worse, the guy taking the photos was aggressive and treated me with suspicion - and to think I was going there to teach students at one of your most well reputed technical universities, complete with invitation in hand.
Oh well, best I stick to countries where I'm treated with basic respect.