British Village Requests Removal From GPS Maps

longacre writes "The tiny village of Barrow Gurney, England, has asked GPS map publisher Tele Atlas to remove them from the company's maps. The reason: truck drivers using GPS navigation devices are being directed to drive through the town despite the roads being too narrow for sidewalks, which has led to numerous accidents. At the root of the problem lies the fact that the navigation maps used by trucks are the same as those used by passenger cars, and they don't contain data on road width or no-truck zones. Tele Atlas says they will release truck-appropriate databases at some point, but until then they advise local governments to make use of a technology dating back to the Romans: road signs."

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The already do resort to roads signs

[sholden]

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=436983 [mailonsunday.co.uk]

I would expect idiots to ignore them, because the computer voice must be obeyed.

Re:The already do resort to roads signs

[Paul Slocum]

According to your FA, they are working: "since the signs were put up in November last year there has been a great improvement."

Re:Road Signs?

[piltdownman84]

Trucks have gotten really bad up here in around Vancouver, Canada. Especially late at night. They pay no attention to street lights, they simply blow their horn and if your lucky you get out of the way. My father wasn't so lucky a few years back. The driver didn't even deny that he ran the red, just said he didn't see my dad. Actually my father was lucky as he wasn't seriously hurt, although that was the end of that van. Everyone I know has a story about how "they almost got killed by a big truck".

I know this place

[Anonymous Coward]

Its fairly near to me and I agree with the residents...

It is a death trap and its not just lorries, its tourists who are getting from the west country to bristol. Its a great shortcut between two major roads, but it was not designed for the amount of traffic that gps sends through. They have seen MAJOR increases in traffic since gps became popular.

The roads are built like they are for horse and cart. They wind up and down and they are very narrow with no pavement, people do die there.

Re:Road Signs?

[CrazyDuke]

Big trucks have some horrendous blind spots, even with all the mirrors. We're (past tense now) taught to clear the lane first. But, in city traffic, things like that and following distance go out the window because everyone is in a contest to see who can be the biggest asshole. And, there is always things like road hypnosis and plain old not paying attention.

Sometimes the "No Trucks" signs get ignored because the delivery location only accessable from that route. But, yeah, I've seen plenty of drivers ignore "No Trucks" signs either because they can't turn around, don't know the road, or are just impatient. I obeyed the signs except in the first condition. The most memerable one I encountered was when a driver hauling doubles wiped out a bunch of utility lines and poles trying to drive down a little country road.

But, keep in mind, just like there are bad drivers in cars, their are bad drivers in trucks. Most know how to handle themselves, even if they sometimes have to get a little pushy, but not all.

Superlorry

[piltdownman84]

This article's timing is very interesting given all the talk about 'superlorries' in the uk press this week. The 'superlorry' is a 60-tonne vehicles, that will fit 60% more goods than the current big trucks in the UK. The government is considering allowing them in the UK, and according to BBC this morning they are currently on test at some small airport. The haulage companies say if approved they will only operate on motorways, but groups are already concerted about these trucks going through small towns, much like this story. Here is an article from the Times: http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/transport/article2943573.ece [timesonline.co.uk]

Re:This is a local village...

[Anonymous Coward]

You're not kidding.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&time=&date=&ttype=&q=Barrow+Gurney,+Bristol,+North+Somerset,+United+Kingdom&sll=51.448099,-0.971502&sspn=0.010377,0.028539&ie=UTF8&cd=1&geocode=0,51.410097,-2.678620&ll=51.408218,-2.675305&spn=0.002597,0.007135&t=k&z=18&iwloc=addr&om=1 [google.com]

I grew up a couple of miles away in Backwell. Barrow is notable for having a secure mental hospital and a decent pub (these are two different institutions, unlike much of the West Country). The road is nuts - it's about as wide as a Kroger aisle, for US slashdotters - and as can be seen on the google image, drops in a couple of places to a single track with alternate traffic flow governed by lights. It's also got low stone walls along the sides for much of its length - anything getting stuck finds it almost impossible to reverse out (think articulated lorry/tractor-trailer) and can block the village for a couple of days, if I remember right.

Re:Real reason

[the Dragonweaver]

Have you ever *been* in Britain? There's places where the roads are narrow because the centuries-old buildings were put in when the road had to be wide enough to accomodate cows. If they say the roads are too narrow for sidewalks, I'd assume there's literally no escape on the sides.

Re:Real reason

[henni16]

Why arent' the roads big enough for sidewalks?

Because there might be houses or lots of private property in the way?

There's lots of old towns with roads so narrow that just a single car can pass; horses weren't that fat when those were built.

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=+Barrow+Gurney&hl=en&oe=UTF-8&ie=UTF8&t=h&z=13&om=1 [google.com]

Re:Why it's not just a matter of signs

[rolfwind]

Build sidewalks. Seriously.

Re:Road Signs?

[Oktober Sunset]

actually, bludgeoning the the British set piece, our pigs don't have guns or tasers, but we do give them extremely vicious steel truncheons instead of the wooden and plastic ones everyone else uses.

Re:Pints

[scruffyMark]

a pint is a *pound* the world around

Except of course that it isn't. A more accurate, if less mnemonic mnemonic, would be "A pint is a pound in the US and exactly nowhere else."

Outside of the states, we know that "A pint of pure water weighs a pound and a quarter." Because, you know, a proper pint is 20 fl oz. Not sure why you Americans have such funny little pints.

Re:Why it's not just a matter of signs

[TomV]

Build sidewalks. Seriously.

Sounds good, except that in a lot of these villages, the space between one side of the road and the other just isn't big enough - it's too narrow for the bigger vehicles already, and adding sidewalks would make it too narrow for a normal car. In plenty of places around here there are single-track stretches in the villages, and even in a car you have to wait your turn to use them. Sidewalks also wouldn't help in cases where the radius of a corner just can't take a long truck trying to turn. Short of moving all the houses back, it's hard to see how you'd make a (say) six-hundred year old village compatible with today's lorries.

Re:I know this place

[Ngwenya]

Sounds like the route should be improved.

Not really. The road has two sharp corners at each end of the village, which slow down cars just fine. Cars, bikes and pedestrians (just) get on fine. The trucks however, do not slow down - and the houses and walls beside the road bear testimony to that.

So I would say that the road is fine for certain types of traffic, but that the GPS nav systems need to be updated to recognise that just because a road is there doesn't mean that it's suitable for all uses. So - not a GPS problem per se: more a data interpretation issue.

PS: The Prince's Motto pub in Barrow Gurney is great, but the cider can get you into a hell of a state. Which makes the road difficult for another reason entirely...

--Ng

Four Wheelers

[venuspcs]

While I am the first to admit trucks do some stupid shit you four wheelers need to understand a few things.... 1.) It takes us a long damn time to get moving and almost as long to get stopped. 2.) Most of us get paid by the mile so unless we are moving we ain't making no money. 3.) 2/3rd's the length of our truck is a blind spot where WE CAN'T SEE YOU... With that said let me explain a few things. 1.) Late at night traffic lights are on a faster cycle than in the daytime. By the time we notice a light is yellow we usually do not have time to stop (safely) before it turns red. This is due to the 80,000 lb weight of our loaded trucks and we just can't stop that damn fast....period. If you four-wheelers would pay attention and watch to see if we are stopping before you pull out there wouldn't be a problem here....but if the light turns green, that means "go" and the hell with what might be happening around you. 2.) You four wheelers get in front of us, with no concept of how hard it is for us to slow down, and you just putt along, refusing to get out of the f'ing way. Then when we try to pass you stay right beside us (usually in the blind spot) and won't move, even if we have a turn signal on....well there comes a time when we just have to move on over. Our livelihood depends on rolling as many miles as possible in the 11 hours the DOT says we can drive and we need to be able to roll, not poke along behind some four wheeler with nothing better to do than PISS US OFF. 3.) There are signs on most trucks now that state "if you can't see my mirrors I can't see you". Well they should be changed to "if you can't see me in my mirrors, I can't see you". Just because you can see my mirrors doesn't mean I can see you. No matter how many mirrors you put on a 70' semi there is always a blind spot and you four wheelers will find it and ride in it all damn day long. Then call us un-professional when we don't see your dumb asses.

I live next door...

[iceZebra]

Sounds like a great opportunity for the law enforcement officers of Barrow Gurney to make some money issuing fines.

Just to clarify things a little...
I've lived most of my life in the village next door to Barrow Gurney. It's barely a village, approximately 400 people... As for law enforcement, it's the local Women's Institute, frowning upon any anti-social behaviour and gossiping people to death.

I used to visit the abbattoir there regularly for fresh meat (braaaiinnns....) but since it shut down, there's no longer and point to visit. Should it disappear off the map, I'm not sure anyone else would mind (apparently including those who live there). :)

In regard to the actual situation in hand, I can confirm that it's a great shortcut for getting round the area "off-piste". The road section in the main part of Barrow Gurney is very, very wide and would fit several lorries in no problem. The only difficulty is that the rest of the village and all access to it is via narrow lanes (for you Americans read: tarmac'd footpaths) and can get a little hairy even in a car.

Re:Road Signs?

[jd678]

Because it's not in France. Unlike most of the rest of Europe, here in the UK there are no legal powers to fine on the spot (actually a deposit for a contestable fine). Instead they take your name and address, and summon you to court to pay the fine later.

For minor offenses for which they don't arrest on the spot, there's no powers of extradition so the summons is quite useless. They'll have to wait until they're caught again in the country, so in nearly all cases the paperwork is far too much so they just ignore it.

They are planning to change the system to the continental deposit method, but only for foreign nationals.

Re:Road Signs?

[Gilmoure]

Hell, we just had a semi hit an overpass on I-25 [kob.com]. If they can't navigate US Interstates safely, how the hell will they handle rural roads?