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REAL ID In Its Death Throes, Says ACLU 315

Posted by kdawson
from the go-ahead-and-board-that-plane dept.
Dr. Eggman points us to Ars Technica for an article on the ACLU's view of the latest loosening and deadline extensions for REAL ID act compliance by the Department of Homeland Security. The rights organization believes that REAL ID is doomed. "The ACLU, which opposes the plan on civil liberties grounds, says that the many changes made since the Act was passed [in 2005] nearly 'negate the original intent of the program.' 'DHS is essentially whittling Real ID down to nothing... all in the name of denying Real ID is a failure,' said ACLU senior legislative counsel Tim Sparapani. 'Real ID is in its death throes, and any signs of life are just last gasps.'"
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REAL ID In Its Death Throes, Says ACLU

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  • Re:Real ID (Score:1, Informative)

    by cromar (1103585) on Tuesday November 06, 2007 @02:58PM (#21258329)
    Totally bad. There is no problem to which Real ID is a solution. We already have state IDs. And federal Social Security numbers. And passports. I can't see any benefit to Real ID.

    The feds got slapped on this one and it is making me laugh so hard. It would make me even happier if thy get their ass kicked.
  • by Nightlily (140378) on Tuesday November 06, 2007 @03:03PM (#21258375) Homepage Journal
    Real ID isn't dying because of privacy concerns. I think (at least in Michigan), it's about the cost for the states. States were ok with the plan until it hit them that it cost them money. Also let's consider the fact the states were asked to basically implement Real ID after they spent tons of money on homeland security.
  • Re:It's a shame. (Score:5, Informative)

    by nilbog (732352) on Tuesday November 06, 2007 @03:18PM (#21258545) Homepage Journal
    No, that's not what its for. Clearly you have been mislead.

    "Under REAL ID, the government would have easy access to an incredible amount of personal data stored in one national database (or, according to the DHS description, 56 State and Territory databases, each of which can access all of the others)."

    The senator from New Mexico (I believe it was New Mexico anyway) said that the ultimate goal is to track everything. Every time you buy something, even with cash, it will be entered into the national database. 7Eleven will require you to swipe your card for purchasing gas, a snickers bar, or explosives from their terrorist discount bin.

    Real ID IS bad news. It has severe privacy implications. Please research before commenting. The quote above is from here [epic.org].

    The purpose of a driver's license is to show and prove proficiency in driving, not anything else. It is not meant as a defacto identification card or anything else. It is a license to drive, period.

    The fourth amendment guarantees us security of papers. How can we have security of papers if all of our information is stored in every government database across the entire union? That sounds like the opposite of security of papers. We can refuse to show our papers, but it won't matter because the government will already have them.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 06, 2007 @03:21PM (#21258593)
    Real ID will not be stopped and it is yet another infringement on our rights by the gov't. Add it to the ever-growing list of violations:
    They violate the 1st Amendment by opening mail, caging demonstrators and banning books like America Deceived (book) [iuniverse.com] from Amazon.
    They violate the 2nd Amendment by confiscating guns during Katrina.
    They violate the 4th Amendment by conducting warrant-less wiretaps.
    They violate the 5th and 6th Amendment by suspending habeas corpus.
    They violate the 8th Amendment by torturing.
    They violate the entire Constitution by starting 2 illegal wars based on lies and on behalf of a foriegn gov't.
    Support Dr. Ron Paul (who raised a record $4 million yesterday) and save this great country.
  • Re:Real ID (Score:4, Informative)

    by onkelonkel (560274) on Tuesday November 06, 2007 @03:50PM (#21258985)
    In British Columbia, the government runs the auto insurance. You can't register a vehicle (i.e. get a license plate) without insurance. Driving without insurance is illegal. Thus, almost everybody has insurance. This also makes "underinsured motorist" coverage dirt cheap, around $25/year, which gives you full coverage whether or not "the other guy" has any insurance or not.

    I'm not saying our system is perfect, but it certainly would eliminate the problem you have described.
  • Re:Real ID (Score:5, Informative)

    by alan_dershowitz (586542) on Tuesday November 06, 2007 @03:55PM (#21259045)
    Article 4, section 1: Full Faith and Credit Clause [wikipedia.org].

    Full Faith and Credit shall be given in each State to the public Acts, Records, and judicial Proceedings of every other State. And the Congress may by general Laws prescribe the Manner in which such Acts, Records and Proceedings shall be proved, and the Effect thereof.
    This is the reason that your state-issued marriage license is recognized in the entire country (and incidentally, why the DOMA [wikipedia.org] Act banning a state's obligation to recognise other states' gay marriages is a crock of crap.)
  • Re:Real ID (Score:3, Informative)

    by UbuntuDupe (970646) * on Tuesday November 06, 2007 @03:59PM (#21259093) Journal
    I'm sure that, on paper, that's exactly how it works here (Texas). It's just a matter of apathetic enforcement of the law. If you really wanted to be sure that no one can get on the road uninsured unless they steal a car, then police would have to show up the moment I pass the renewal deadline for my insurance policy without replacing it or transferring ownership of the car. Needless to say, this doesn't happen. I've seen ads where the police offer temporary "warrant amnesty", giving you a chance to turn yourself in for outstanding warrants. Now, if they have that big a problem following up on warrants (where there's actually a judcial order for arrest), what are the odds they're so vigilant about uninsured drivers?

    And then of course, both B/C and Texas do nothing about the possibility that someone will buy a car (and they check you for insurance on the secondary market, right?) and then share it with illegals.

    It's all nice and feel-good that uninsured driving is illegal, but all that means is more hassle for people who obey the law. Criminals and illegals can effectively evade it until an accident.
  • by compro01 (777531) on Tuesday November 06, 2007 @04:36PM (#21259663)
    agreed. i don't get it. they let you drive, smoke, vote, and go die for your country, but you can't have a beer for another 3(?) years?

    drinking age here is 19, which makes more sense to me.
  • Re:Real ID (Score:3, Informative)

    by OldeTimeGeek (725417) on Tuesday November 06, 2007 @05:00PM (#21259969)
    A report [ncsl.org] commissioned the National Governor's Association, the National Conference of State Legislatures and the American Association of Motor Vehicle Administrators puts the cost to the states at around $11 billion. The DHS puts the total cost at $23 billion over the next 10 years, of which $14 billion will be picked up by the states.

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