Vonage Wins Permanent Stay in Verizon Case

kamikaze-Tech writes "The US Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit in Washington DC today issued Vonage a permanent stay of a previous court's injunction that would have barred it from signing up new customers. Vonage sought the stay following an April 6th decision by the US District Court in Alexandria, VA enjoining the company from using certain VoIP technology to add new customers."

Good!

[norminator]

Here's to hoping everything goes well throughout the rest of the appeals process.

Corperate America wins again

[Shambly]

Somehow i doubt this case will result in a large portion of the Patent laws being repealed. Vonnage will look at its cost/risk analysis and decide that paying royalties to Verizon is much better then facing the risk of losing their business. A settlement will be reached behind closed door. All this posturing is merely a game of trying to reach the minimum amount of royalties they have to incur. Two large corporations fighting each other will not result in more freedom for the rest of us. The patent business is to profitable to jeopardize by bringing an argument to court.

I would have thought...

[Anonymous Coward]

this to be a no-brainer, considering what SCOTUS has already said about injunctions. This [wikipedia.org] was actually a pretty important case, in recent history that the injuction issuing judge should really have read. I am pretty sure Verizon couldn't show the injunction met the 4th requirement. Actually, I think they would have a hard time showing items #1 or #3, as well.

Somehow I can't imagine that Verizon really wanted

[soft_guy]

Somehow I can't image that Verizon really wanted to cause Vonage to immediately go out of business which is what would have happened had they not gotten this stay. They would have been out of business by the time the case made it to trial and Verizon wouldn't have received much if anything.

Does the general public know?

[RobertB-DC]

This is a huge story among us techno types, but does the general public have any clue?

Just last night, I got the usual pack of coupons in the mail... including one inviting me to choose Vonage for my local phone service. I'd wager nobody on my block has ever heard of the Vonage vs. Verizon patent battle. What happens to these folks -- especially the non-technical ones who don't even understand the 911 and VoIP thing [911voip.org] -- if Vonage eventually loses its case entirely?

Or is Vonage's strategy now built around pumping up the customer base in advance of the inevitable bankruptcy and fire sale of their only remaining asset: their customer list?

Re:Corperate America wins again

[(A)*(B)!0_-]

"Vonnage will look at its cost/risk analysis and decide that paying royalties to Verizon is much better then facing the risk of losing their business."

What makes you think Verizon is willing to license to Vonage?

"All this posturing is merely a game of trying to reach the minimum amount of royalties they have to incur."

Or it's a matter of Verizon trying to sue Vonage out of business.

"The patent business is to profitable to jeopardize by bringing an argument to court."

Huh? How do you think the injunction came into existence in the first place? Verizon has already taken the argument to court.

Re:Corperate America wins again

[NeutronCowboy]

It's likely more profitable for Verizon to obtain royalties from Vonage then to have them take over their business.

No. Monopoly rents are more profitable than any royalty or customer payments.

It is more profitable for them to charge large licensing fees to Vonage then to destroy them.

And one way to destroy Vonage is to charge licensing fees that are larger than Vonage's profit margin. It's win-win for Verizon, really.

Re:Ok, so now what?

[vertinox]

Well... 15 years ain't that long.

Hopefully, mankind in the next few years will patent every obvious idea possible so that by 2030 we can get back to actually inventing real non-obvious inventions.

Re:Link to the actual text of the patent in questi

[P3NIS_CLEAVER]

It seems that they have patented using a computer to store information and to facilitate a transaction.

Re:Good!

[jez9999]

What is there to appeal against? "The patents system is fucking retarded and you should throw the case out on principle"?

Re:Not so fast on that 'huge sigh'

[greenbird]

Very true, but it gives them time to try and get around the patents in question.

They can't work around them. The patents basically cover converting an IP address to a phone number [american.com] and visa versa. It's impossible to connect VoIP to the phone network without doing this. Unless or until the patents are determined to be invalid Verizon owns VoIP and can shut down any company that ties VoIP to the phone network.

Re:Does the general public know?

[ivan256]

Actually, apparently you do get it.

Unfortunately many techies read way too much into the situation and assume that you get sub-par E911 service on your Vonage phone. It's just plain not true. The only additional complication is that you need a UPS for your router so you can call 911 when the power is out.

Email response from Verizon!

[An0maly]

i emailed verizon about this crap last time there was a big thread. here is my email and the response:

I recently read about Verizon's attempt to stop Vonage from allowing VOIP calls to connect to old telephone systems on basis of "patent infringement". If I recall, other companies used the technology mentioned before Verizon had acquired those patents. I have to say that I'm angry and baffled.

What is the ultimate goal for this type of action? Do you think that all of the Vonage customers who could potentially be without service soon would flock to gobble up everything Verizon has to offer? Don't you think that those people that have Vonage land lines, but have Verizon cellular service might reconsider their wireless provider when it's time to renew the contract? I don't have a wireless phone, but I had considered getting service from Verizon. You guys just shot that to hell. Well done.
- Show quoted text -

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: [e-mail]
Date: Mar 23, 2007 3:38 PM
Subject: RE:Verizon.com Consumer email response [#16185185]

Thank you for contacting the Verizon eCenter. I have received your email dated March 23, 2007 regarding our recent lawsuit with Vonage. Thank you for taking the time to provide us with your comments. My name is Wendy, and I will be happy to assist you.

We appreciate you sharing your concerns with us. We value the opinions of our customers and those that visit our website. On March 8, 2007, a jury found that Vonage Holdings Corp. had infringed three United States patents awarded to Verizon covering methods of offering commercial-quality VoIP services, including wireless access to VoIP.

As stated by John Thorne, a Verizon senior vice president and deputy general counsel, "Patents encourage and protect innovations that benefit consumers, create jobs, and keep the economy growing. Verizon's innovations are central to its strategy of building the best communications networks in the world. We are proud of our inventors and pleased the jury stood up for the legal protections they deserve."

I hope I have resolved your reason for contacting us. If you have additional questions, or if we may be of assistance to you in the future, please let us know. We look forward to serving you.

Thank you for using Verizon. We appreciate your business.

Sincerely,
Wendy
Verizon eCenter

to customersupport

          Mar 23
My main question is what constitues infringment by Vonage and not others who offer identical service? Will you be suing all companies that are able to bill by the minute (every wireless carrier on the planet)? All VOIP providers that connect to POTS (Virtually ALL cable providers)?
- Show quoted text -

          Mar 26
Thank you for contacting the Verizon eCenter.

I apologize for the delay in my response, and I regret any inconvenience to you.

My name is Jamie and I have been forwarded your email with further questions regarding the Vonage lawsuit. You wanted to know if Verizon plans to pursue other companies who have produced the same services as Vonage. You also wanted clarification as to what constitutes infringement by Vonage, and not other VOIP carriers.

Vonage is the only company to our knowledge that used our specific patents to produce their products. Other VOIP companies that offer this service were able to provide this service using a different method other than our patents.

At this time, we do not have any intention to pursue other companies regarding this issue. We are not aware of other companies that have used our patents to produce this service.

If any further companies attempt to use a Verizon patent, a press release will be issued advising of any plan of action against other companies.

I hope this has clarified your concerns.

Thank you for using Verizon. We appreciate your business.

Sincerely,
Jamie
Supervisor
Verizon eCenter