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Privacy

Social Network Users Have Ruined Their Privacy 308

Steve Kerrison writes "'There's little point in worrying about ID cards, RFID tags and spyware when more and more people are throwing away their privacy anyway. And the potential consequences are dire.' I've written an article on the dangers of social networks and how many users seem to forget just how public the information they post can be. This follows a warning sent out by the CS department of Bristol University, advising students that they risk lost job opportunities, getting in trouble with their parents and more, if they don't take care. The warning, however, really applies to all social network users, be they college students or over-zealous blog posters."
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Social Network Users Have Ruined Their Privacy

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  • @Generation (Score:1, Interesting)

    by TodMinuit ( 1026042 ) <todminuit@@@gmail...com> on Tuesday December 26, 2006 @09:39AM (#17365934)
    To those born in the 1990s, the @ symbol is more familar than the dial tone. Gone is pen and paper, replaced with keyboards and pixels. Friendships are made via mathematical graphs instead of face-to-face contact. Teenagers no longer crave privacy, instead opting to publish their entire life in a blog. Small circles of friends now strech around the world. Graphical paradise has replaced your own backyard.

    Welcome to the @Generation.
  • Re:@Generation (Score:2, Interesting)

    by gogodidi ( 885953 ) on Tuesday December 26, 2006 @09:49AM (#17365992)
    puh... close one, I was born in 1989... but seriously, a lot of my friends at school are pretty stuck in this social networking thing. One girl at school even flew to aberdeen to date someone she met over myspace... I am so glad I hate myspace... After reading a book called "crypto" by Steven Levy, and reading about Diffie and Zimmerman made me realize how precious privacy really is. I am not as private as I could be, I gave my website URL to slashdot, and on my website I have my real name somewhere, and on other websites I am not nearly as private as I should be, but I am not telling every schmoe out on the internet what I did last weekend.
  • by IkeTo ( 27776 ) on Tuesday December 26, 2006 @09:51AM (#17366012)
    > advising students that they risk lost job opportunities

    Strange. When I seek for jobs I worry much more about employers not knowing me enough rather than they know me too much. And no employer will be bored enough to actually read every message in your blog to find your "most silly moment" before he decides whether to hire you.
  • This is bullshit. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by entrigant ( 233266 ) on Tuesday December 26, 2006 @09:57AM (#17366052)
    Erosion of privacy is when personal details about your life are taken from you. It's when police chiefs talk about tapping everyones home or looking up library records without a warrant. If I willfully give away information about myself then I never did consider it very private then, did I? This crap about lost opportunities, while perhaps partially true in today's freakishly religious climate, will not be such an issue as these things become more common. This is absolute proof that the minority voice controls the world. Damn near everyone has to lie about who they are because they're afraid everyone else lives some higher "moral" standard and will look down on them. This is simply not true. Even the noisy types who push this false sense of morality on us hardly practice what they preach. As a global community develops and communication with the entire world becomes simple and cheap the world will shift as knowledge becomes free. You will no longer have to worry about losing your job because there is a picture of you with a joint on someones myspace page or your hair is dyed neon blue. The transition period will not be smooth, but I welcome the day. All this article does is beg us to continue living in fear of some invisible and nonexistent moral majority. I, for one, refuse.

    It is already happening. The company I work for was founded by two young entrepreneurs that grew up in the age where knowledge was free and they learned that masturbation won't cause hair to grow on your hands or your dick to fall off. They learned that the D.A.R.E. cop that told them the story of the young man who died from ONE hit from a joint was LYING. They realized that nobody else they grew up with believed this horseshit anymore either. They only care about your skill and your work ethic. As the younger generations start to take back this world it will become a better place to live because of the global community and available, simple worldwide communication.

    Do not fear it. Embrace it.
  • Re:Keep in mind (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Potor ( 658520 ) <farker1&gmail,com> on Tuesday December 26, 2006 @10:10AM (#17366136) Journal

    That's true - unless social networking is being set up as a sort of honey trap encouraging people to compromise their futures. Hence, I would not stress this difference as a dichotomy - but rather as two moments of the same phenomenon.

    People are giving away their freedom within a now-corporate framework that encourages this kind of activity. Just remember that.

    As with fidelity/client cards, purchase-rewards, and fast-tracking at airports, the web 2.0 is training us to surrender our personal lives for the most meager of rewards. This kind of surrender almost seems propaedeutic for a greater, involuntary loss of privacy. But then again, Americans have already lost their freedom to credit reports.

  • An example (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Snorklefish ( 639711 ) on Tuesday December 26, 2006 @10:49AM (#17366440)
    Not long ago, Skadhi Myers blogged [skatje.com] about anti-homosexuality attitudes in her high school. In doing so she quoted the bigoted facebook comments of jock and student body president Andrew Jallon:

    Okay this is really random but it has to deal with the comment about homosexuality issue that Sibley brought up. Honestly why must our country keep discussing this issue. We all know it's wrong and that it just shouldn't be that way. If you want to go with the same sex move somewhere else. Please before we ship yah off. Honestly just get rid of them and then we won't have this issue. Just ship them to Canada. But yah homosexuality is just wrong so just say no and get over it. It's never gonna be right so yah!!
    Then someone from ScienceBlogs linked to her post because it was well written and she's the daughter of P.Z. Myers... a fairly well known blogger. So the meme really picks up speed. The next thing you Andrew finds he's coming under attack for quotes he never expected to be disseminated across the continents.

    But reading the quote, one wonders who is this Andrew Jallon guy. Well, a quick google and you can see check out his discus and shotput attempts (not very good). PUBLIC real-estate tax records give a strong implication as to where he lives. And finally, Andrew Jallon's bigoted comments end up on Slashdot. Did he expect this? Should he have expected it. Should we all be paranoid about every post...lest someone take it and run?

  • by neimon ( 713907 ) on Tuesday December 26, 2006 @11:26AM (#17366804)
    It's hard to create safeguards when we're not even sure of all the negatives.

    I remember before there were consumer protection laws, and if you bought a defective car, too bad sucker. That was the way for years. Am I going to argue that all safeguards are an infringement? No. Am I going to argue that we're figuring it out? Yes.

    Please don't apply simple "take personal responsibility for the fact the world sucks and hates you" rules. We can make it better, but we have to know what's wrong first.

    It's nice once in a while to talk about what's right, but, yeah, that's not nearly as sexy and frightening.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 26, 2006 @12:24PM (#17367402)
    The answer is simple. You edit your myspace/blog/whatever to fit your current view; don't keep old entries lying around, especially if you don't agree with what you once said or you've otherwise changed. If you're really afraid of the past coming back to haunt you, be just as smart as your perceived adversaries: post entries of apology explaining why what you said or did was wrong and make up for it now, while the apologetic entry is going to show up in logs just as old as the cache of whatever is so incriminating. Don't slack, write a whole essay about it. Put a copyright on it. Push the agenda.

    Don't fear the day when they drag up the old mud and you have to stand at a podium or in front of a press conference, or across the desk from your boss and say, "Yes! I said and did that -- I also made up for it. And if you look at the bigger picture, I'm a more valuable person overall, far outweighing the small blemish in my history this mudraker is flapping." Don't forget that you did what you did because you were confident in the fact that there world had supplied you with an environment and a situation in which your behaviour was acceptable to yourself and to others. If you see that window of opportunity shrinking, then congratulations -- you aren't the same person you were before; your perceptions have changed. Either that, or you were having a panic attack, watching your freedom erode while your person developed, and you experienced a frenzy of mad behaviour like a rat in a corner. Rat on yourself. But be confident in who you are, including who you were.

    Confidence is what drives markets, and if you want to market yourself effectively, you have to be confident in who you are. Loss of confidence is what's really driving down the economy in America, but information brokers are having a heyday. So if you don't find confidence in yourself, but you do have confidence in all of your demons, there's one other option: start storing information incriminating others in your blog or journal. Start being the one who keeps track of all the bad things people are doing. Rat on everybody else.

    If you're right about all this, then one day you'll have a fortune in greymail. Start with these comments in this forum. Track down all of these anecdotes about RL/OL gone awry, follow up on all of them, every bit, and seal it in seperate manila envelopes marked "do not open til doomsday". But don't forget the number one rule of blackmail: if you're not ashamed, you can't be had. And since we've all been informed for decades, now, that shame is caused by shaming and that shaming is a component of abusive homes, we should know better than to be ashamed of ourselves, and that shaming others is abusive.

    Extortion is far more worth worrying about than blackmail, but if you're afraid that just because you put your home address online, you're going to be made a target any more than if some psychotic walking down your street decides they don't like you because of the numbers on your door or the look of your vinyl siding, then what you're really talking about is some trend in dangerous psychotic people showing up in higher numbers online than in the everyday carbonspace world.

    If that's true, than that is the final and sole crux of the matter, and the question no longer lies anywhere in the realm of "information" or "privacy" but really becomes about psychiatric treatment and deprogramming. So don't let history's most primitive confidence scheme rule your life: either invest in commodities, or go see a shrink. Otherwise, bad people will continuing bad things.
  • Re:so? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Lord Ender ( 156273 ) on Tuesday December 26, 2006 @01:09PM (#17367882) Homepage
    The generation that went to college in the era of Facebook/Myspace already expects to be able to find drunken ramblings and absurd photos of themselves and their friends online. This generation thinks less of a person who has a web presence that indicates no social life. Who wants to work with a boring person? Once these people are in charge of hiring (another 10-15 years) this won't be seen as a bad thing for many companies.
  • by tompaulco ( 629533 ) on Tuesday December 26, 2006 @02:29PM (#17368666) Homepage Journal
    As a parent, I was blissfully unaware of the dangers of myspace. Having gottent the general idea of how stupid and pointless it was, I never bothered to visit. Of course, I have repeatedly informed my children of the danger of carrying on conversations with total strangers. So I thought I was covered. Bu the other day, out of curiosity I checked myspace to see if my stepson had an account. It turns out he did, but that the profile was private. Now, I would guess that his profile was private because he doesn't want us (his parents) to see, not because he doesn't want some stranger to see. He probably has all kinds of inappropriate stuff on his myspace page that we would get upset about, so he has it private. This is just a guess, but the fact that he has a picture of himself wearing only boxer shorts on his front page, with a description of himself as a wrestler and his interests as looking to meet people on the internet pretty much means that everything we have told him he has pretty much thrown away and done the opposite.
    Now I am sure that a legitimate operation like myspace properly notifies parents that their underage child wants to create an account and automatically grants the parent full access, so I am sure they will be sending me that information shortly.
  • Re:so? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Fulcrum of Evil ( 560260 ) on Tuesday December 26, 2006 @03:10PM (#17369012)
    If they care that much about me being a sarcastic ass on usenet in college, maybe it's not my kind of job, is it?
  • by roamingapril ( 991481 ) on Tuesday December 26, 2006 @03:15PM (#17369056)
    Gee, he's warning kids that if they post on myspace, then the older generation (parents and future employers) might disapprove. Of course, the kids don't care, and why should they? They don't WANT to live in the same culture as their parents. Personally, I find the myspace culture to be preferable to the older culture. With everybody's flaws exposed on the internet, people will learn to be more tolerant of others' shortcomings, and tiny mistakes and personality quirks will no longer seem scandalous. (For example, do you remember the Howard Dean scream? Why should something like that disqualify somebody from the presidency?) The older generation is just a bunch of stuck-up, blissfully ignorant whiners, who are upset that their children aren't conforming to their expectations.
  • Re:This is bullshit. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by dangitman ( 862676 ) on Tuesday December 26, 2006 @06:38PM (#17370976)

    The company I work for was founded by two young entrepreneurs that grew up in the age where knowledge was free and they learned that masturbation won't cause hair to grow on your hands or your dick to fall off. They learned that the D.A.R.E. cop that told them the story of the young man who died from ONE hit from a joint was LYING. They realized that nobody else they grew up with believed this horseshit anymore either. They only care about your skill and your work ethic. As the younger generations start to take back this world it will become a better place to live because of the global community and available, simple worldwide communication.

    I dunno. The guys you are talking about probably grew up in the 60s or 70s, when idealism was very strong. This current generation of young people is scarily conservative, but even worse, they seem to be corporate whores. I wouldn't expect many of them to rock the boat in substantial ways. Sure, they may have their dyed hair, tattoos and their genital piercings, but that's just the new conformity - it doesn't demonstrate actual rebellion or subversion. Even those idealists from the 70s sold themselves out pretty quickly. I think much of the younger generation is already sold out - they just stick to the corporate-accepted level of "flair" and naughty behavior they are allowed as long as they keep buying the products.

    As an example, you mention drugs. When I was using marijuana, we protested for legalization, we had organizations to promote the truth about drugs. I don't see many kids doing that now. Instead of pushing to change the laws, they know they can get away with it if they are discreet with their usage or know the right people. In many ways it is regaining its "taboo" status, and is consumed with a wink and a nod, not in proud defiance.

  • by MarkusQ ( 450076 ) on Tuesday December 26, 2006 @08:46PM (#17372234) Journal

    Ignoring, more or less, your pugnacious tone, your argument seems to boil down to the claim that revealing passwords, PINs, etc., or things (such as your SSN) that are effectively used as such, is somehow equivalent to revealing the sort of personal information (sexual orientation, political affiliation, taste in music, and so on and so forth) that people might reveal on MySpace. And further, you somehow assume that anyone who does things that I won't do for you on demand must lack the "ability to reason in a logical fashion" or be "an utter idiot."

    I of course beg to differ.

    Your first point is clearly nonsense (a claim you can easily disprove by providing links to a few dozen publicly available MySpace pages with SSN's, bank account numbers, PINs, and the like).

    On your second point I would claim that anyone who would reveal password-class information to a person like you, on an open web forum or not, would be the utter idiot. On the other hand, I have no qualms about telling you that I'm a fiscally conservative life-long registered Republican who voted a straight Democratic ticket in the last election because I'm tired of seeing our country run into the ground by a pack of clueless morons, no matter which party they ran under. I like classic rock and some modern stuff, but can't stomach more than a little rap or new age. And so on and so forth.

    In case you still don't get it, the point of being "effectively immunized" is to not live as if you have any personal secrets that you wouldn't tell your boss / parents / spouse anyway. If you're going to prance about in undergarments that aren't gender appropriate, put up a web site detailing the whys and wherefores, and then if anyone tries to blackmail you by threatening to "out" you say "Oh good! Give them my URL while you're at it; I could use more page hits" and that is pretty much the end of it.

    --MarkusQ

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