Paramount Sues Ohio Man For $100,000 724
ematic writes "A hapless tech-novice finds himself in a US$100,000 lawsuit with Paramount Pictures for allegedly uploading the movie, Coach Carter, to eDonkey. Paramount had the police seize his four computers, but nothing was found. The tech-novice maintains his innocence, and contends that he is a victim of a drive-by upload. According to the ChannelCincinnati story, the victim 'is either a slick film pirate or an unwitting victim of someone who fits that description.'"
Tech Novice? (Score:4, Insightful)
Indeed... (Score:4, Insightful)
Which is of course why these kinds of tactics don't, and won't, work in the long run. All the unwitting victims just net you bad publicity, while the slick file pirates just sit and laugh.
What the... (Score:5, Insightful)
Movie companies have the right to look at all the computers in your house, because you allegedly commited *copyright infringement*.
Wow.
Some people just waste money (Score:5, Insightful)
Motive? (Score:5, Insightful)
There are a lot of unanswered questions here. This is typical of the big media companies now, just like the Mafia: shake down the little people and get the word out that you should toe the line and pay your protection money, or we'll get you.
I do agree that circumstantial evidence seems to suggest he's a bit more tech savvy than one might think, but on the other hand, a tech-savvy person can also get their network broken into or their password stolen. Basically, this company doesn't have a leg to stand on. Maybe that's why they're shaking him down for so much money, to make him feel he has no choice but to settle.
Re:Tech Novice? (Score:3, Insightful)
Of course, as a result, she does have a lot less issues to deal with than I do with my machines
2 things: (Score:5, Insightful)
Seriously? $100,000? Quick math tells me that he would have had to share the movie 4,547 and 1/2 times to have shared enough copies to equal that price tag. I get the idea of a deterent but man. Side note even if the film was compressed to around 700 megs or so (to fit on a CD) that would take 3,183,265 and some change megabyes of bandwidth (3 terabytes if my late nite mind is still working at all) to share that file that many times. Seems a little unlikely the punishment fits the crime.
2) Isn't there a burden of proof on the prosecution in this case? Don't they have to show he was the one responsible for uploading the file? If someone steals my car then commits a drive by shooting, I can't be held responsible, can I? To me, having an open wireless access point seems perfectly reasonable (if that is your preference) and it would seem to be a tough sell to get a judge to fine this guy when there's no evidence he did anything wrong and he can produce a line of reasonable doubt.
I'm not up to date on case law in the US, so maybe I'm wrong but seems really shaky at first glance.
Well that makes sense (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Tech Novice? (Score:2, Insightful)
Family Laptop
Kid's Computer
Work Laptop
Family Desktop
Kid's Computer
Other Kid's Computer
Work Laptop
Family Desktop
Kid's Desktop
Work Laptop
Wife's Work Laptop
Family Desktop
Kid's Desktop
Old Family Desktop Collecting Dust in Storage
Work Laptop
etc... etc...
Police Priorities? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Perjury is a Crime (Score:2, Insightful)
And don't you know, internet pirates be dangerous people YARR!!! What's a little bit o' perjury for those scurvy devils....
"Drive-by"? (Score:5, Insightful)
I admit I haven't seen "Coach Carter", and I'm not using hard numbers here, but I estimate that uploading an entire motion picture at any worthwhile quality would take at least six hours, maybe twelve. That's not a drive-by, that's your next-door neighbor using your bandwidth all day long.
Re:What the... (Score:3, Insightful)
You can't afford the legal fees to get you the same rights as the MPAA. You're legally classified as a nobody. Bill Gates, however, is a respected member of the community - respect in the order of several billions I believe. The courts won't even be interested in anything you have to say.
Re:What the... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Tech Novice? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:$100,000? (Score:2, Insightful)
For what it's worth, I think it's a bad concept. The punishment should not exceed the 'crime'. And if the damage can't be calculated accurately, it's better to err on the side of the defendants , even it it means some real infringers will walk away.
Re:What the... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Tech Novice? (Score:5, Insightful)
I find it bizarre that, just because certain people are not fans of the concept of intellectual property as it applies to movie downloads, they automatically assume that someone who is accused of breaking these laws is innocent.
I find it bizarre that you would assume he is guilty. What ever happened to "Innocent until proven guilty"? If he is guilty, let the evidence speak to that fact. The burden should be on the prosecution to prove that he in fact did commit the crime.
Re:Perjury is a Crime (Score:5, Insightful)
Piece of cake ... (Score:4, Insightful)
Then figure out that persons MAC address, and spoof it with MAC change on ur router/firewall .
Upload ur movie, reset, adios .
Odds are it isn't even that brilliant, the guy with the router prolly picked a MAC address
assigned to a NIC type that he does not even own, as the list is published .
He prolly picked the last few hex digits at random .
Alot of dorm ppl are doing this to ppl that have their computers direct connected ,
and the Uni is too cheap to replace the hubs at the edge of the network .
So they don't get fried for doing p2p over their dorm connect .
If they had managed switches at the edge of their network they could stop this behaviour .
Not all Uni's have switches at the edge of their network yet, ones where sports is
more important often neglect the tech/sci to spend multiple millions on chasing sewn
together animal skin, aka baseball, volleyball, football, basketball .
Stadiums and Arenas that could house all the US homeless 10 times over are left empty
more days than they are full, pathetic .
We wonder why other parts of the world are starting to pass us by
Rome...Bread and Circuses...
Ex-MislTech
Re:Some people just waste money (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Plausible deniability (Score:1, Insightful)
Not even remotely true. Are you trying to tell me that the courts expect Joe Sixpack and Jane Boxwine to understand the civil and criminal implications of buying a Linksys router at Best Buy and just plugging it in?
With halfway-competent defense, no judge or jury on planet Earth would hand down a guilty verdict in a trial where the defendant was using an open access point. Civil, criminal, I don't care.
Re:most likely the guy is lying (Score:3, Insightful)
More information needed... (Score:5, Insightful)
This guy I know has a lot of guns. He also makes a lot of his own ammo. Recently, he *gasp* cleaned his pistol. Clearly he is hiding evidence and he is the killer we are looking for.
Re:The first test of my theory (Score:3, Insightful)
Seriously (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Tech Novice? (Score:2, Insightful)
in the current state of the judicial system, it's guilty until proven innocent.
Re:Tech Novice? (Score:5, Insightful)
Knowing the MPAA/RIAA and their tactics, the definition of "four computers" was probably more like:
He should count himself lucky if they didn't take his cell phone and wristwatch.
What I'm curious about is this: How the hell did Paramount have the police seize four of his computers? IANAL, but last time I checked, that would have required a search warrant obtained by a judge with probable cause that he commited a crime. Even assuming that they went through that trouble, it would be law enforcement officers who would investigate the computers, not Paramount. But TFA specifically says, "Paramount has looked at all four computers in Lee's home..." Hmmm...
I figure the more likely scenario is that Paramount told the guy, "If you let us have your computers, we won't sue you." The guy, not being a lawyer and thinking that was a good deal, said, "Okay," then erased one of his hard drives, since he was at least smart enough to know that if Paramount found what they were looking for they would have sued him anyway. (Or maybe he's innocent and just didn't want them to see his downloaded porn collection; either way doesn't matter.) Then Paramount, mad, sued him anyway.
The guy needs to go get a really lawyer pronto. Whether he's innocent or guilty, Paramount is going to do their best to screw him, and personally, even if he's guilty, I hope he comes out of this clean. Not because I think that sharing files illegally is okay, but becuase they (Paramount) are using crooked tactics that are much worse than the crimes this guy may or may not have committed.
Re:Piece of cake ... (Score:2, Insightful)
This is a friendly message to let you know that you are stupid.
"ur", "ppl", and "prolly" are not even -close- to words. Please become literate to a minimum sixth-grade level before inflicting yourself on us.
Thank you!
Re:Tech Novice? (Score:3, Insightful)
You can have four cars and still don't know how an engine actually works
Re:Tech Novice? (Score:2, Insightful)
Ironically, TFA mentions that Paramount is accusing him of the "crime" based on evidence that he wiped his drive recently. At my store, when we get Windows machines on the bench, that's usually the best option--image HD if customer so desires, wipe the HD and reinstall Windows and any programs, and restore legal data. Windows gets so junked up while these people use their computers that antivirus isn't an option, so many drives get wiped every single day.
So it wouldn't surprise me at all if he actually does own four computers, networks them wirelessly, and has no idea what he's doing. I help people in similar situations all the time.
I guess he's learned to secure his WiFi. Paramount has no case, and the industry continues its downward, anti-consumer spiral.
Re:Motive? (Score:2, Insightful)
fishy, perhaps. Innocent until proven guilty (at least I hope that's still true...)
Re:Tech Novice? (Score:5, Insightful)
Nope. Don't forget the Patriot Act. You're guilty until trial, which may happen at an undetermined time, without a lawyer, in a closed court of the government's choosing. If the government things you did something against it, you'll find yourself rotting in Southeast Cuba, or any number of non-existant prisons in countries where they'll ignore the happenings of non-existant front companies who happen to own prisons in remote areas.
[knock][knock]
Who's at my door?
Re:Plausible deniability (Score:4, Insightful)
As someone living in the third world, I am constantly amazed at how little protection is afforded the average American by their laws. Obviously, I am not refering to O.J.Simpson or Michael Jackson.
And yet the death penalty has pretty much universal support!
Not only is it shocking that these Corporations seem to be all-powerful and there seems nothing that ordinary Americans can do against them, but they seem to have sanction from every section of your community.
Everybody here seems to be saying: "Well, I believe he did it, he should hang". Nobody seems to think how ludicrous it is to pursue ordinary citizens for these kind of punative damages.
Wow.
Re:Plausible deniability (Score:1, Insightful)
Really? I thought that assumption was exactly why lawyers get the big bucks. They have the cleverness (and know-how) to get around the legal system.
Nah, I'm not really this cynical about law and lawyers, but I could use the ill-gotten karma. Reward me for cheap shots! Please!
Re:Tech Novice? (Score:5, Insightful)
I think the moral here is that the argument/alibi for excusable irresponsibility because the network was unsecured probably isn't working so well.
Re:most likely the guy is lying (Score:3, Insightful)
From time to time I can see my neighbors wireless connection. If I so desired I imagine I could mount an antenna and use it with with great reliability... granted that would be wrong but the fact of the matter is it's possible. In fact I just had a call last week about a friend setting up a new laptop and boom... instent wireless access... and was asking about the morality. As I couldn't see anything in jiwire on the subject, given the name is something like "linksys" or "dlink" or something generic I had to say it was probally not a free hotspot but some joker that didn't know any better. The moral thing to do would be to inform them of the condition and tell them to call technical support.
My point is, while I think this sort of think carries with it some bad mojo, and isn't quite ethical.... there are others who'd spy a unsecured connection, or even hack a secured one, for the obvious benifit of tapping someone else's bandwith with pretty much no accountability and very little risk.
Re:Motive? (Score:5, Insightful)
You'd have to be savvy enough to know you need to secure erase, paranoid enough to think you might be nailed at any time, and proactive enough to schedule erasure for every night at 5:00am (Bedtime).
It's not that I don't think that a person could be those things. I do think, however, that a person who is ALL of those things would be unlikely to be mistaken for a neophyte by anyone.
Re:Tech Novice? (Score:5, Insightful)
Amazing how the law bends when huge corporations are involved...
Welcome to the land of the free and the home of the paranoid!
Re:Piece of cake ... (Score:3, Insightful)
Failure to do this last bit indicates contempt for your audience -- and a general lack of class on your own part. Think of
I realize that being told that you should go out of your way to change your habits isn't much fun -- but if you don't want to be looked down on by those who might otherwise have cause (even if you think it's bad cause) to consider themselves your betters, you should seriously consider it.
Re:Motive? (Score:5, Insightful)
This reminds me of the "you have encryption tools, you must have something to hide" bit from a couple of months ago...
There is absolutely nothing illegal about having encryption tools, or having wiped your HDD with something stronger than a format.
Try:
He is cleaning an axe: he must be an axe murderer.
She has covered a car: the car underneath must be stolen.
He paid cash: he must be engaged in tax evasion.
There are lots of activities that honest people engage in every day for reasons that are their own ... I think the reason we see this is because poeple don't understand technology, and so anything can be considered dangerous, malicious or evidence of illegal activity.
Re:Tech Novice? What's screwed up about this is (Score:5, Insightful)
With digital content being wrung harder for profits and with the studios and others hell-bent to make examples of others, and with the police needing to show the public its money is being well spent, it's probably inevitable that more people will be pulled into the hollywood/content provider dragnet.
The best thing WE can do is to archive ALL our work and make SO many identical copies that it would be PROFOUNDLY egregious (in the eyes of a FAIR judge AND in the eyes of the public) for ANY police or complainant to say "give us ALLLLL of your archives, no matter how redundant they are".
What the law enforcement agencies need to do or be FORCED to do is this:
Perform NO search and NO seizure unless the party asking for the warrant provides forensic and archival equipment to protect the accused from suffering work stoppage, psychological damage (hey, I'd go goddam ballistic if my shit were seized, as I PAY for my DVDs and music, even if it costs $15-$30-- I don't even really lament not copying music from amaroK), and to keep unnecessary eyes from prying too deeply and too long at stuff on the seized machines that is NOT their business (business plans, school work, love letters, research...), not of danger value and probably would take them YEARS just to sort out before even reading the multiple versions and revisions of endless stuff.
Nice police will insist the accusers not run all over the accused. We're supposed to be innocent until proven guilty. With abuse of unsecure (not INsecure) internet access, poorly protected windoze boxes, ignorant users, and a lot of greedy or lazy pirates and "fair-use" abusers, it's just a matter of time before almost ANYone with a computer connected to the Net is a recipient of a boilerplate letter.
SCARY.
Re:Piece of cake ... (Score:2, Insightful)
I'll agree phrases like "ppl" and "ur" make the author sound immature, but we all use shortcuts on a daily basis.
Re:most likely the guy is lying (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Plausible deniability (Score:3, Insightful)
If you believe this to be true, I recommend you seek out other media sources for your news about American affairs, as we are FAR from unified in our views about the death penalty.
Re:Tech Novice? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Perjury is a Crime (Score:3, Insightful)
My wife took the course and it certainly helped her a great deal. My friend stopped attempting to hack us after she demonstrated her knowledge on his server
As for wireless security, rule number 1 is to assume you'll never secure it 100%. I don't care what technology you use, its possible to crack it given enough time. Remember we are talking about a network everyone has "physical" access too. I can sniff my neighbors networks. I know of programs to figure out keys. Watch traffic to find valid mac addresses and spoof one to get past mac address protection. There are ways to get into wireless networks. When i added a wireless router to my network, i put up firewalls on each of my hard wired machines. I'm even considering making a seperate interface in my main router (a freebsd machine) for that traffic to lock it out of my main network using firewall rules there. I'm using WPA2 personal and i don't feel all warm and cozy. Just remember, anything you do on a wireless network should be encrypted if its important with another layer of security. For example, my imap and smtp servers use ssl/tls encryption for logins. My websites have SSL enabled so that i can access them securely while using wireless. I use sftp to transfer files to wireless machines, etc. I also realize that any IM conversation i have can be read by others either on my end or on my friends end. Think about it this way, I can do everything right here, but he could be at a cafe with no encryption on at the other end.
Finally, buy a copy of 2600 sometime and find out whats possible. It isn't the end all source, but most people with any computer background can get something out of those articles. Its a good read. Best Buy had a lot of wireless problems because they are idiots.
Re:Piece of cake ... (Score:3, Insightful)
Yeah um no... Maybe thats what YOU think slashdot is but not everyone is exactly like YOU, now are they?
To me slashdot is a tech oriented daycare where there are 10 000 people all saying "notice me" or "i have something to contribute" or "in soviet russia..." etc. Most people are generally ignored. People are generally here from 9am to 5pm EST, work in some IT related industry and basically come becuase they dont have enough work to do. The ratio of interesting posts to non interesting usually falls around 1:50 (one out of 50). Critizing someones grammer or spelling is imature in this environment. its not a stuffy academic environment, its not a business environment where we all have to pretend to get along. To me slashdot is where the true flab of the underbelly of the internet occasionally bursts through its seams. If your lucky, you get a small glimpse of reality, like the flab, before the whole thing gets covered with makeup and glitz.
oh and additionally, i did proof read this post, as i do with all my posts. Perhaps words like 'ppl' arent actually an error, or a product of lazyness. What if they are a natural progression of language? Personally i think that words like 'you' and 'are' shouldn't be shortened. Big words like 'people' should be.
i did see your user id. it doesnt scare me.
Multiculturalism (Score:4, Insightful)
"But they aren't Arabs, so instead of blowing people up..."
Shame on you.
Multiculturalism is a good thing. But it is basically an illusion because it assumes that all cultures are equal and that people are basically good.
However, we owe it to the thousands of people who have been randomly murdered by the adherents of a specific culture that there is the possiblity that certain cultures may be disfunctional and therefore be unable to be able to understand and follow the ideals of multiculturalism.
I deliberately chose to emphasize the fact that since the beginning of the modern age of terrorism, it has been the Arabs that have consistently and deliberately blown up random non-Arabs to bring world attention to their issues. No other people have done this to the extent that the Arabs have. I therefore am compelled in the memory of the people randomly and horribly murdered to call attention to the possiblity that it is the Arab culture that is unable to function within the ideals of multiculturalism. I should be ashamed and would be ashamed to say that this particular culture is disfunctional in the modern world, were it not for all the blood and body parts lying in the street whereever Arabs feel that they have been mistreated or slighted by either history or the modern world.
Re:Tech Novice? What's screwed up about this is (Score:2, Insightful)
Not being argumentative, but unless you or someone on this board can recommend a lawyer admitted to the bar in his state that would take the case on spec, he might be just as out of luck as the rest of us would be.
Re:Tech Novice? What's screwed up about this is (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Piece of cake ... (Score:3, Insightful)
Well then, since it's so easy, let's have a bit of a challenge here.
Throw away your ID, birth certificate, social security card, credit cards, and any other documents or identification. You won't be needing them for this challenge-for the homeless, they're long since lost or stolen.
Throw away any cash you have on hand, your car keys, your checkbook, your ATM card, and any other access to currency. If you want money, you will have to go hold out a sign, perform on the street, or otherwise get hold of it that way.
Now, you're not quite good and homeless yet. Don't take a shower or change your clothes for a week.
Now-go find a job. And if you can do it, I'll happily agree with your point.
Re:Tech Novice? (Score:3, Insightful)
No it doesn't.
"begs the question" has more than one meaning.
Get over it.
Comment removed (Score:3, Insightful)