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U.S. Rejects Canadian Rejection of DMCA 870

Posted by timothy
from the spy-vs-mountie dept.
P Starrson writes " Slashdot readers may recall that last month Canadian policy makers rejected the DMCA for Canada. Not so fast apparently -- the U.S. Trade Representative has released the annual Section 301 report which each year tells the rest of the world that they need stronger intellectual property protection. This year Canada is a particular target -- the U.S. plans to conduct a special review of Canadian policies and explicitly rejects Canada's rejection of the DMCA. A good summary on what this means from Canadian law professor Michael Geist."
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U.S. Rejects Canadian Rejection of DMCA

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  • Moderation (Score:3, Funny)

    by fembots (753724) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:01PM (#12400749) Homepage
    Is it like moderation and meta-moderation in Slashdot? In the end nothing matters.
  • Meanwhile... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by brxndxn (461473) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:02PM (#12400759)
    the American public rejects the DMCA.

  • by MrBigInThePants (624986) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:02PM (#12400761)
    Do you think Bush could leave other countries alone for 10 bloody seconds??

    Isn't screwing your own country up good enough?!
    • by epiphani (254981) <epiphani@ d a l . net> on Sunday May 01, 2005 @06:00PM (#12401304)
      As a Canadian, I'd put forth that we reject the US's rejection of our DMCA rejection.
      • by StratoChief66 (841584) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @06:05PM (#12401340) Homepage
        Don't bother, they will just reject our rejection of their rejection of our rejection of the DMCA. Perhaps a simple 'fuck you' is in order.

        This could drive an even bigger wedge between our two countries, but the shit the US has been pulling under Bush makes me wonder why I would care what they think?
        • by epiphani (254981) <epiphani@ d a l . net> on Sunday May 01, 2005 @06:12PM (#12401427)
          They care about Canadian IP laws for the same reason many americans cite as why canada should just shut up.

          The US and Canada have incredibly tightly integrated economies. BOTH countries export and import 80% of their goods with each other. Mutual dependance.

          The US wants the same laws as often as possible. It makes commerce easier. What if canada suddenly made oranges illegal. We dont grow any oranges up here, so only the importers would be affected. But believe me, some orange producer down in the states would be hopping mad.

          If our IP laws are more lax, it makes canada a better place to do buisness in certain cases. Lost american jobs, lost american revenue. Of course they're pissed.

          Maybe they should fix their IP laws instead of trying to fuck up ours just as badly as theirs are.
          • by pafrusurewa (524731) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @06:40PM (#12401710)

            The US and Canada have incredibly tightly integrated economies. BOTH countries export and import 80% of their goods with each other. Mutual dependance.


            Huh? Surely this can only be true for Canada as there aren't enough Canadians to buy 80% of U.S. exports?
            Let me quote the CIA World Factbook.
            • Canada
              • Exports - partners: US 86.6%, Japan 2.1%, UK 1.4% (2003)
              • Imports - partners: US 60.6%, China 5.6%, Japan 4.1% (2003)
            • United States
              • Exports - partners: Canada 23.4%, Mexico 13.5%, Japan 7.2%, UK 4.7%, Germany 4% (2003)
              • Imports - partners: Canada 17.4%, China 12.5%, Mexico 10.7%, Japan 9.3%, Germany 5.3% (2003)
          • by edunbar93 (141167) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @07:13PM (#12402019)
            he US wants the same laws as often as possible. It makes commerce easier. What if canada suddenly made oranges illegal.

            Or what if the US made Canadian beef illegal? Or Canadian lumber? Or Canadian wheat? Well, the last two aren't banned, they're just heavily tarriffed despite a "free trade" agreement between the two countries. But that's not the point.

            America doesn't care about the effect it has on other economies. It just wants its way. And because Canada needs the US more than the US needs Canada, they can use that leverage to force us to change our policies to benefit their industries.

            And in this particular case, American jobs and American revenue aren't lost, because the industries affected are reimbursed by the taxes the Canadian government collects on the blank media people use to copy the stuff that the DMCA is supposed to protect. The RIAA just doesn't like it that way and wants to have laws that force us to buy new copies of the same stuff every time the technology to play it back changes.
          • by microbox (704317) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @07:35PM (#12402234)
            Maybe they should fix their IP laws instead of trying to fuck up ours just as badly as theirs are.

            Some smart people in the US must know that their IP laws will put them at an economic disadvantage... all they have to do is get the whole world to adopt them, and then the party can continue indefinietly!
        • by MrBigInThePants (624986) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @06:13PM (#12401434)
          What I find amusing is that you find rejecting a facist policy such as the DMCA a "fuck you".

          What I find a bigger "fuck you" is feeling that he can push his internal policies on other countries, even if they stand to hurt that country and its own internal policies.

          It is a bit like trying to turn countries from socialism/communism using mulitary coups and CIA involvement, even when it is against the will of the people. (sometime at home as well)

          Oh wait...that already happened....many times...
        • by j0e_average (611151) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @08:07PM (#12402490)
          Remember to keep separate the American citizens from the American Government(TM). The citizens are a fun-loving group, who generally like Canadians, Europeans, Asians, and Australians very much. The latter is a sock puppet for the corporation.

          Sadly, the people haven't been in charge for decades.

          Give us your pity, not your hate.

      • by smagruder (207953) <stevem@webcommons.biz> on Sunday May 01, 2005 @07:29PM (#12402174) Homepage
        As an American, I support your rejection of our rejection of your rejection.
      • by belmolis (702863) <billposer@alum. m i t .edu> on Sunday May 01, 2005 @10:54PM (#12403733) Homepage

        As both a Canadian and an American, my suggestion to the Prime Minister is that he inform the United States that Canada will consider the United States' concerns about intellectual property when the United States conforms in both policy and practice to the Geneva Conventions and the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. It's one thing to disagree about details of trade policy and the like, but for the United States to make it sound like Canada is a rogue nation that fails to abide by widely accepted standards of decent conduct is outrageous. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black!

    • by quarkscat (697644) on Monday May 02, 2005 @12:03AM (#12404119)
      Shortly after 9-11-2001, Dubya was quoted as saying
      "If you aren't with us, you are with the terrorists."
      This world view has been applied to the liberal
      press and opposition politicians (anthrax letters), as well
      as the American people (USA Patriot Act(I)).
      The Bush administration equates violations of the
      DMCA as "acts of terrorism" as well.

      Between trade conflicts over soft wood products and
      beef cattle imports, Canada is on the "short list"
      to join the "axis of evil". Or to quote a more liberal
      Republican president with an accidentally "live"
      microphone, "Bombing starts in 15 minutes."

      I sincerely hope our neighbors to the north have
      "dug in", because I suspect things are going to get
      dicey there this summer. (Canada DOES have oil,
      after all.)
  • Beeing from canada (Score:5, Insightful)

    by anethema (99553) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:03PM (#12400767) Homepage
    The USA can suck my balls if they want us to adopt the DMCA. We dont even want the concessions they have made as it is, never mind the full DMCA.

    While im sure it will eventually happen, I've certainly been calling local politicians and telling them about my feelings towards the DMCA and copyright legislation change.

    The only way to keep things the way they are is to voice to those in charge that this is the way you like it! Come on canadians dont get lazy on this one.
    • by Anonymous Luddite (808273) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:38PM (#12401081)
      >> The USA can suck my balls

      Careful there Anethema. There are 295,734,134 people down there - you'll get a seriously chapped bag.

    • by Wavicle (181176) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:38PM (#12401082)
      The USA can suck my balls if they want us to adopt the DMCA.

      So I take it you reject the U.S. rejection of the Canadian rejection of the DMCA?

      You do realize that U.S. IP holders would reject your rejection of the U.S. rejection of the Canadian rejection of the DMCA??
      • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:48PM (#12401165)
        Dear Professor Millington,

        Thank you for your letter of March 16. After careful consideration, I regret to inform you that I am unable to accept your refusal to offer me an assistant professor position in your department.

        This year I have been particularly fortunate in receiving an unusually large number of rejection letters. With such a varied and promising field of candidates it is impossible for me to accept all refusals.

        Despite Whitson's outstanding qualifications and previous experience in rejecting applicants, I find that your rejection does not meet my needs at this time. Therefore, I will assume the position of assistant professor in your department this August. I look forward to seeing you then.

        Best of luck in rejecting future applicants.
        • That's freaking brilliant! I MUST try this. The chances of this actually working are much higher than me legitimately landing a good job.

          Thank you for the idea, now I'm off to the patent office.

    • by myowntrueself (607117) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @06:01PM (#12401308)
      "The USA can suck my balls if they want us to adopt the DMCA."

      Well you know what Condeleeza Rice would say to that, don't you?

      "Present them", thats what she'd say.
  • As a Canadian... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Robber Baron (112304) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:06PM (#12400786) Homepage
    I say it's way past time Canada and the rest of the world told the US to go fuck itself.
    • by RollingThunder (88952) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:21PM (#12400923)
      That's exactly what I entered this thread to say.

      They can continue ruining their own country, and we'll run ours the way we want to. We're a sovereign nation that decides it's own affairs, no matter how much they may have difficulty with the concept.
    • Re:As a Canadian... (Score:5, Interesting)

      by koreth (409849) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:22PM (#12400928)
      As an American, I agree. My country is far too full of itself for its own good. Arrogance and pushiness are not virtues.
      • Re:As a Canadian... (Score:5, Informative)

        by Coryoth (254751) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @06:24PM (#12401546) Homepage Journal
        Unfortunately the USA is doing a remarkably good job of fucking itself. Right now the US economy is walking a rather fine line. Let me explain:

        The US has been living beyond its means - that is, it has a huge current account deficit: net capital inflow to the US far outweighs capital outflow. In and of itself that isn't necessarily bad, and is certainly no reason to panic: it has happened before, and will likely happen again. The issue is more about the reasons for the current account deficit. In a large part it is due the continued budget deficits of the current government, but is also due to US consumers appetite for imported goods without a similar growth in US exports. In theory this situation is naturally correcting via a falling US Dollar: imports become more expensive, and exports become cheaper more attractive to foreign buyers. The US Dollar has been falling (quite significantly) against world currencies for the last year or more. This drop hasn't yet caused a turn around in the current account deficit - it has continued to grow apace.

        Mix a falling Dollar (via pressure from the current account) with the current growing demand for oil from China and the resulting increase in oil prices, and you have a powerful recipe for inflation. Again, this is an issue that can be dealt with: the Fed can raise interest rates to combat inflation, as they have been doing very steadily for the last 6 months or more. The risk is that raising interest rates too high will put serious pressure on an already slowing economy, and has risks for the (rather bubble like) US Housing market.

        US consumers, and the US government, have been abusing the line of credit offered on the strength of the US economy (and the expectation that the US can grow its way out of the debt). Things are beginning to look a little tight, and the Fed is now walking a very fine line trying to combat inflation without killing the economy in the process.

        The nest year or two could be very interesting indeed.

        Jedidiah.
        • by bigberk (547360) <bigberk@users.pc9.org> on Sunday May 01, 2005 @07:23PM (#12402122)
          Right now the US economy is walking a rather fine line
          I just wanted to add, if you think this is just a lefty slashdotter doomsday scenario or something, it's time you read this article by Paul A. Volcker [washingtonpost.com], the past Federal Reserve chief before Alan Greenspan. The piece from last month entitled "An Economy On Thin Ice" articulates the warnings many of us in economic circles know; excess credit bubble, dependence on foreign capital; sucking dry 80% of world's savings without producing growth, etc.
    • Re:As a Canadian... (Score:5, Interesting)

      by ogewo (652234) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:27PM (#12400978)
      I say it's way past time Canada and the rest of the world told the US to go fuck itself.
      If people in this world weren't so oversensitive you could say just that and it would be very effective. Instead people tip-toe around the issue and sugar coat and diplomatize to the point where a hegemon doesn't realize they've overstepped their bounds. The headline "Canada: Fuck off USA" would be like a shot to the jaw, it would knock a little sense into the politicians.
    • by hype7 (239530) <u3295110@@@anu...edu...au> on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:39PM (#12401087) Journal
      I say it's way past time Canada and the rest of the world told the US to go fuck itself.


      damn straight. in particular, it can go fuck itself with it's IP law.

      I can't begin to get over the gall of a country, "reviewing" other countries laws and - get this - rejecting them!! I bet it will now apply political and $$$ pressure until it gets its way.

      American IP law is the US's worst export. What it fails to realise is when the Chinese rise in the next 20 years, it's going to come back and bite America on the ass

      -- james
      • by JWW (79176) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @06:04PM (#12401334)
        Don't make China out to be the hero anywhere in this. China respects NO ONES IP law. Not American, not Canadian, not European. They will copy anything and everything and sell it back to us for less.

        What will really bite foreign businesses working in China in the ass is when the government marches in and takes all of their IP and tells them to just deal with it.

        China is the far side of the issue. If American bussinesses thing that their CUSTOMERS pose big IP problems for them, the Chinese will really teach them a lesson eventually.
        • by myowntrueself (607117) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @06:40PM (#12401704)
          "Don't make China out to be the hero anywhere in this. China respects NO ONES IP law."

          Er, that would be *why* they are a hero in this.

          IP law is bunk. Pure, unadulterated bunk and bullshit.

          • by natrius (642724) *
            IP law is bunk. Pure, unadulterated bunk and bullshit.

            That is ridiculous, and I think it's sad that this got modded insightful. The writers of the American Constitution saw a need to protect creative works, inventions and the like, and I agree with them. If you can't make money off of your ideas anymore, you'd stop trying to think of new ideas because you'd have to get a paying job. People would only invent new things to "scratch an itch" or to accomplish something they needed within their paying job. Su
            • by torpor (458) <jayv@@@synth...net> on Sunday May 01, 2005 @07:39PM (#12402266) Homepage Journal
              If you can't make money off of your ideas anymore, you'd stop trying to think of new ideas because you'd have to get a paying job.

              did the dot-com bubble not teach you americans anything?

              you CAN'T make money off ideas!!!!!! you need to produce something.

              americans are so high on hollywood hype, do they not know anything about what really puts food on the table, what really counts in the global market? putting up real product, not just "ideas", oh so precious, is the new rule for global trade.

              China is good at that. America is shit at it.
        • Re:As a Canadian... (Score:3, Interesting)

          by aftermath09 (521504)

          I think what the parent is referring to is the fact that business will innovate far quicker in china because they will not get caught up in the ip red tape that is in the US.

          I see your point, but I doubt the chinese government are that stupid as to waver foreign investor confidence and "take all their ip" as you say. instead, increased taxation in a profitable business sector is a far more PC and palatable approach.

          you see, the US patent law seems to try to protect ideas from being profited on by others,

    • As an American... (Score:5, Informative)

      by PhoenixFlare (319467) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:58PM (#12401264) Journal
      Hurry the hell up and do it already, with my blessing.

      Looking at the old 301 reports, I see mention that Canada has been on the "Watch List" since 1995, along with a host of other countries.
    • Re:As a Canadian... (Score:5, Interesting)

      by beforewisdom (729725) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @07:14PM (#12402035)

      I say it's way past time Canada and the rest of the world told the US to go fuck itself.


      I think it is way past time for Canada to point out to the UN that the US is in violation of UN resolutions, has had questionable elections, and should be invaded by a U.N. force to restore democracy.

      If Conoleeza Rice and Tom Delay are part of the collateral damage we will learn to live with it.
  • And, of course (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:07PM (#12400790)
    The actual citizenry of either country has yet to be asked whether they actually want the DMCA, since most of the people don't even know it exists and probably most of congress doesn't even know it exists, since it was passed by voice vote without anyone in congress actually reading it.
    • Re:And, of course (Score:5, Interesting)

      by nametaken (610866) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:23PM (#12400940)
      This is a good point. Our PR class covered the DMCA a couple weeks ago, and our teacher couldn't stop saying, "this is the world we live in, folks".

      I got the impression most kids didn't know it even exists, and this is on a college campus where liberal ideas are tatooed on your forehead as a prereq for admission.

      Even my strctly conservative father doesn't like the DMCA after a brief explaination of its implications. I think people just don't know what its all about.

  • The u.s. is in the transition to a wholely IP based economy, the DMCA is their lifeblood to a prosperous future. Log onto cspan sometime and watch the Greenspan-meets-congress videos, he keeps telling them "We need stronger IP laws.." Without any doubt his opinion holds more weight than yours ever will. I don't have much to say to young idealists or anybody with a inkling of hope left except, submit to your masters, it'll be easier.
    • by Colin Smith (2679) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:29PM (#12400995)
      This is really just an exercise in power, the US will back up these strong suggestions with threats of trade sanctions etc.

      The thing that gets me as someone who lives in Britain and recognises the behaviors of the British Empire in the past is that Americans don't recognise that they live in an empire in all but name.

      There seems to be a sort of xeno blindness, nothing outwith the US borders exists and therefore cannot be important. The result being these kinds of strong arm tactics used against sovereign nations. Guess why large portions of the world are antithetical.

      • by BlueFashoo (463325) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:51PM (#12401192)
        As an American, I can say that many of us do, and we don't like it. Chalmers Johnson recently wrote a book [tatteredcover.com] called the Sorrows of Empire making the case that we are indeed an empire in all but name. This realization has been slowly growing. People who make the claim that we are an empire are less often dismissed as cynics. Even the Economist [economist.com] is claiming that we are an empire.

        We have military personell in over 135 nations. [whs.mil] Most have less than 20 and are probably guarding embassies, but more than you would think have over 1000, including Belgium. The UK has over 13,000. It can be said that the sun never sets on the American Empire.

        Many Americans are horified by this. Some are proud of it. Some are both horrified and proud.

        Another interesting site
      • by Hortensia Patel (101296) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @06:08PM (#12401379)
        Americans don't recognise that they live in an empire in all but name

        Leaving aside the pitfalls of generalizing about "Americans" (something that's becoming increasingly meaningless as that nation polarizes) and confining discussion to the red-staters, I'm not sure the problem is that they "don't recognise" that the US is an empire. It's more that they don't recognise that it's a bad empire. The British Empire wasn't exactly shy about announcing itself, but jingoistic pride, cultural arrogance and a nationalistic media all combined to ensure that its citizens were generally happy about that empire.

        I think the same holds here. Read a topic like this at -1 and you'll find a fair number of posters who like being in the American Empire. They like the "we're number one!" thing, they like the knee-jerk machismo that flows from military adventurism, they really do think they're God's chosen country, and they're perfectly willing to let their leaders trample over a world they see as filled with terrorists, godless communists and spineless Eurotrash.
      • by demachina (71715) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @06:16PM (#12401475)
        "the US will back up these strong suggestions with threats of trade sanctions etc"

        Well in answer to that all I need do is point out that Canada is America's largest external supplier of oil and I would guess probably natural gas. I'm pretty sure that China would be glad to take all of Canada's oil currently going to the U.S. if the Bush administration were to be their usual arrogant selves and start a another trade war. Venezuela is on the verge of doing just this and they account for another big chunk of America's oil imports like 12% if I remember. This tactic wouldn't work very well if there was a surplus in the oil markets but there isn't a surplus now so it DOES work very well.

        For a country that is completely dependent on the rest of the world for energy and is by far the world's largest debtor nation its threats are starting to ring pretty hollow. The U.S. does have the honking big military but its been established that the American military is pretty impotent as long as you don't go toe to toe with them in the open and opt for an insurgency instead.

        The U.S. really does need to be blessed with an attitude adjustment that when you have become completely dependent on the rest of the world for energy, completely dependent on other nations to to prop up your massive debt, and most of your manufactured goods come from abroad that you are a pretty impotent nation and the rest of the world can start treating you as such.
  • by Mawen (317927) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:07PM (#12400795) Journal
    I reject U.S.'s rejection of Canada's Rejection of DMCA.
  • NAFTA? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by xanthines-R-yummy (635710) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:08PM (#12400803) Homepage Journal
    Is this related to NAFTA at all? Could the USA claim the Canadian rejection of the DMCA violates NAFTA somehow? Or could Canada use NAFTA to uphold their policy on DMCA?

    Just some random (and probably irrelevant!) thoughts...

    • Re:NAFTA? (Score:4, Informative)

      by c (8461) <beauregardcp@gmail.com> on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:57PM (#12401261)
      Could the USA claim the Canadian rejection of the DMCA violates NAFTA somehow?

      The USA might make that argument. But it's just as likely that the DMCA ban on badly defined "circumvention" devices could be held to violate NAFTA, just like a Canadian ban on dangerous gasoline aditives was found to violate NAFTA.

      c.
    • Re:NAFTA? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by jbr439 (214107) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @07:10PM (#12401980)
      Even if rejection of the DMCA violates NAFTA, all Canada has to say is that it will be upholding the ruling in the same manner as the US has upheld the rulings on softwood lumber.

      For those that don't know, the US has ignored every, single ruling against it on the softwood lumber issue.

      The US seems to only like free trade when it is in the US's favour. Otherwise, f*** it.

  • by Phil246 (803464) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:09PM (#12400808)
    How on earth do the bought-and-paid-for senators in the states think they can make laws for other countries - without invading them. America, at this rate is well on the path to destroying itself through either corporate corruption - or alienating the rest of the world against it.
    • How on earth do the bought-and-paid-for senators in the states think they can make laws for other countries - without invading them.

      The same way the US ones were made: bribery and, er.. well, just bribery, really.

      TWW

  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:09PM (#12400815)
    ...that Canada qualifies as a circumvention device?

    Uh oh
  • by snookerdoodle (123851) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:10PM (#12400832)
    It just meant that Canadian lawmakers are more in tune with the values of the typical United States citizen than are the members of the U.S. Congress and Senate.

    Well, at least in this particular area... ;-)

    I don't think anyone is surprised anymore that our lawmakers write laws that reflect the values of lobbyists. :-(

    Mark
  • What? (Score:5, Funny)

    by Farrell (564771) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:11PM (#12400835) Homepage
    I thought we settled States Rights during the civil war, and agreed no state could reject federal law ;)
  • by Malicious (567158) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:13PM (#12400848)
    Perhaps if the USA opens the border to Canadian Beef , softwood lumber, and settles all the other open trade disputes Canada could CONSIDER, reconsidering such a bill. But I doubt it.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:15PM (#12400865)
    ...that I am sick and tired of America's attempts to tell other countries what to do. When commenting in this thread, please keep in mind that not all Americans feel that we should be so meddling, and only 51% of Americans were willing to re-elect the current administration.
    • 51% of Americans who voted.

      Of course I was in that 49% who voted for the other guy.
    • by linguae (763922) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @06:16PM (#12401463)
      When commenting in this thread, please keep in mind that not all Americans feel that we should be so meddling, and only 51% of Americans were willing to re-elect the current administration.

      This isn't even about Bush, per se. This is about corporations bribing the politicians into passing laws that only benefit Corporate America(TM), not looking out in the interest of its own citizens, and wanting to impose the same corporatist ideology on every other country.

      Give me a break! The Democrats and the Republicans seemed to get bribed at every turn by the RIAA and the MPAA. The DMCA was passed under the Clinton administration, and I heard that not a single Democrat voted "no" on that bill. The RIAA and MPAA are taking away our freedoms piece-by-piece. No, I don't condone copyright infringement, but why must the *AA pass laws that restrict legal fair use (for example, the DMCA)? The DMCA only benefits the RIAA, MPAA, and Disney, and is a major blow to our rights of fair use. Why should the government tell me what to do with my own DVDs? How come I can't legally rip the contents of my DVD to another medium?

      The corporatism here is getting sickening and maddening. Both the Democrats and Republicans have failed at curving this rampant abuse of the government, and most of the citizens seem to be ignorant about all of the rights being taken away. We need to start boycotting the RIAA and MPAA, and never buy a new CD or DVD, purchase online media, download media legally or illegally, visit a movie theater, or do anything else that profits these media cartels until they stop bribing the government. We need to get people to start getting informed about the DMCA and rally average citizens to start writing letters and doing protests against the DMCA and other abuses of our copyright laws.

      Copyright and other forms of "intellectual property" is supposed to "To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries." What ever happened to "fair use" and "limited times to authors"? Copyright is life + 95 years now (thanks to Disney), and our fair use rights are being trampled over by the DMCA and some other newly passed laws. We need to restore copyrights to what they used to be. This government has gotten too corporate, and we need to make it work for the PEOPLE!

  • Is the pure arrogance of this lost on US Policy makers?

    When a country makes it clear that they are not interested in your fucked up copyright laws, maybe your laws might not be as good as you think they are.

    This sort os stuff is only goint to get worse, as a Canadian, I plan to urge my government to stop trading with the USA as much as possible, and start trading with Europe, or China, or India instead.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:16PM (#12400873)
    Canadian DMCA rejects YOU!
  • Jesus christ (Score:3, Insightful)

    by jb.hl.com (782137) <joe.joe-baldwin@net> on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:16PM (#12400875) Homepage Journal
    I'm beginning to think the US government passes more laws outside the US than it actually does inside the US...

    Oh yes, stronger IP laws. Just what everyone in Canada needs and wants.
  • sigh (Score:4, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:16PM (#12400876)
    all this rejection is reminding me of high school....
  • Yankee Go Home (Score:5, Insightful)

    by McGiraf (196030) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:18PM (#12400893) Homepage
    If the US can tell us what to do the we should have a say in their election, and it would probably sound like this:

    Canada rejects Bush.

  • by ded_si_luap (846428) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:22PM (#12400931)

    Miss Canada: "Uncle Sam, Don't prod your nose where it don't go. Three times before I tossed you out in the snow. If you keep hacking, you'll get a darned good whacking"

    Uncle Sam: "Oooohhhh - I like being whacked! Whack me here, Whack me there. Whack me on the bed, and under the chair. Whack me by whip, Whack me by stick. Whack me in Nam, Whack me in Iruq. Now I'll get whacked from little miss Canuck!

  • As a Canadian... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Mr. Flibble (12943) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:22PM (#12400935) Homepage
    As a Canadian I have to say - "STAY THE FUCK OUT OF OUR LAWS."

    Granted, as the U.S. is our largest trading partner, we have a number of things that are a little "grey" or messed up... For example, if it was not for the U.S. influence we probably would have legalized pot long ago.

    I love the minority government we have right now though - our Prime Minister just denied a number of the White Houses requests because there could have been a forced election if he went against the will of the people. I hope it continues this way - bizzare concept I know - the will of the people driving things?

    What is really sad is that much of our law is based on the changes that came about in the U.S. oh, about 200 years ago... (And English law as well)
    • Re:As a Canadian... (Score:5, Informative)

      by Emetophobe (878584) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @07:28PM (#12402168)
      This reminds me of a U.S Religious Lobby group that has been trying to stop/prevent Canada from legalizing same sex marriage. I can't find the original story link from the Toronto Star, but managed to find others.

      Here [typepad.com] here [about.com] here [emergence.qc.ca] here [samesexmarriage.ca]

      Here is a quote from one of the stories:

      Powerful U.S. religious groups are sending money and support to allies in Canada to fight same-sex marriage.

      Patrick Korten, vice-president of communications for the Knights of Columbus head office in New Haven, Conn., said no limit has been set on the help his organization is prepared to offer. "Whatever it takes," he said. "The family is too important." Mr. Korten said the U.S. headquarters of the Catholic men's group paid $80,782 to print two million postcards being distributed in Catholic churches across Canada. "It has been extremely enthusiastically received in Catholic parishes all over Canada. As a matter of fact we may have to print some more -- there was a great deal of interest in it. It offers a quick, simple but effective way for Catholics ... to make their feelings about the same-sex marriage bill known to their MPs." Another opponent of same-sex marriage, Focus on the Family, is also sending support and services worth hundreds of thousands of dollars a year to its Canadian affiliate. James Dobson, the charismatic founder of Focus on the Family who has been described as one of the most influential Christian figures in the United States, personally waded into the debate two weeks ago in a radio show taped in Colorado Springs, Colo., and transmitted as a paid broadcast to 130 stations in Canada. "It is clear here in the United States that the American people do not want same-sex marriage. I would hope that Canadians who also do not want same-sex marriage would be encouraged by what has happened down here."


      What the hell is wrong with the USA, when they have to force their religious beliefs on other countries? Canadians hate being told what to do by Americans, and we usually will do the opposite of what they want, just to spite them.
  • Dammit (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Sv-Manowar (772313) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:24PM (#12400954) Homepage Journal
    "tells the rest of the world they need stronger intellectual property protection"

    How about telling the US they need a stronger currency so the people making money legally from the DMCA can actually convert it without being left with peanuts. I love the hypocrisy of the US at the moment. God bless Canada for having the balls reject it.
  • by geomon (78680) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:25PM (#12400958) Homepage Journal
    I guess they should be shaking in their boots now, eh?

    Why do US policy makers assume that every country needs to have the exact policy as we have? One of the founding priciples of US conservatism is the preservation of sovereignty. That principle has meant that the US has ignored the call for a Canadian-style medical system, or the foreign policy goals of the EU. For good or ill, US conservatism demands that countries decide what is in their own best interests and guide their foreign and domestic agendas accordingly.

    Now these conservatives are demanding that Canada abandon sovereignty and model all of their intellectual property laws after the US?

    US 'conservatives' have the intellectual consistency of baby shit.
    • Now these conservatives are demanding that Canada abandon sovereignty and model all of their intellectual property laws after the US?

      No, these are not the same conservatives, these are NeoCons, and they have absolutely nothing to do with the founding principles of US conservatism except for using the Replublican Party brand.

  • by PhYrE2k2 (806396) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:43PM (#12401122)
    Canada to join nearly all other developed countries in implementing the WIPO Internet Treaties


    Riiiight- all other developed countries. You'll notice how they stress this like it's the norm and the baseline everyone has. Canada isn't the odd man out, but rather the US is in this case.

    Note most Eurpoean and Asian countries, and even in Canada-like Austrailia, have IP laws nowhere near the stupidity of the DMCA.

    The US is not the norm. The US is trying to impose it's views coming from CORPORATE AMERICA and project them not only on the individuals but also on the individuals in other countries (all 6 billion of them). The DMCA only removes rights from individuals and gives it to corporations.

    -M
    • by dbIII (701233) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @08:06PM (#12402488)
      even in Canada-like Austrailia, have IP laws nowhere near the stupidity of the DMCA
      No in Australia we rolled over and agreed to put in some US style IP laws to get a trade deal - a trade deal which ended up screwing Australia over in other ways and delivering nothing that was originally promised (sugar, beef, steel - why did we ever think we had a hope on these?). As a consequence the Australian government, which has previously been saying yes to everything the USA proposed, is taking the Chinese view on the Taiwan situation to try to get a trade deal with China. Whether Australia actually implements these laws remains to be seen and probably depends on how bad the trade deal looks to the electorate in years to come, and US-China relations.

      Australia went into Iraq with mercenary intentions - please the USA and we get this fantastic new trade deal. It's probably fair enough that we got screwed with a deal that is one sided - but can't expect much when the Australian govenment is incompetant enough to deport its own citizens by mistake.

  • by zoogies (879569) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:45PM (#12401139)
    You can reject a rejection? Sweeet! I'll keep this in mind when I some day apply for a job.
  • by jbr439 (214107) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:46PM (#12401149)
    What nerve. The US refuses to honor its own laws and international treaties concerning the softwood lumber issue with Canada (yes, I am in BC), yet insists that Canada implement the draconian DMCA or something similar.

    I hope the government of the day has the balls to tell the US that we refuse to talk about IP until the US honors the NAFTA rulings re softwood lumber.

  • by saskboy (600063) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:58PM (#12401269) Homepage Journal
    Please write your MP on this matter. Use my letter below if you don't want to write your own.
    Send your letter for free (no postage necessary), to your MP at the following address:
    [your MP's name] M.P.
    House of Commons
    Ottawa ON K1A 0A6

    Find their email address, but write by paper mail too. http://www.parl.gc.ca/information/about/people/hou se/PostalCode.asp?lang=E [parl.gc.ca]

    Dear Mr. Breitkreuz
    To summarize the issues in this letter:
    1. Internet Service Providers should not be required to keep extensive logs of private and legal online communications.

    2. The government must not stop Canadian citizens from making personal-use copies of their legally purchased software, music, and movie media.

    Background:
    http://pch.gc.ca/progs/ac-ca/progs/pda-cpb/reform/ statement_e.cfm [pch.gc.ca]

    Here is the reasoning:
    The purpose of the Copyright Act is to support creativity and innovation in the arts and culture. To design a new Act on the failed and draconian Digital Millenium Copyright Act of the United States of America, would be a disaster for Canadian culture, and innovation. Also our court system could become clogged with law abiding citizens who make personal use copies of their music, software, and movie collections for no personal financial gain. An implementation of the proposed changes to the Copyright Act would unleash another "Gun Registry boondoggle" onto the Canadian people - creating criminals out of law abiding citizens at the expense of Canadian taxpayers.

    Internet Service Providers like Sasktel should not be made to keep extensive client usage logs for possible future prosecution by various copyright-based industries. I don't want to pay for that system to be put into effect, and I don't think most people do. The phone companies are not forced by the government to record the content of phone conversations, only police can do that with a proper warrant. ISP logs are going to be equivalent to phone-taps, and that's a violation of my privacy. It's doing the job of the police, and is for the sole benefit of an industry basing its profits on an outdated business model that is no longer realistic for the Canadian government to protect.
    It is completely unfair to be paying a levy to artists organizations for purchasing blank CD media to make home-use private copies of legal CD music, and now to also be unable to legally copy the music I've paid for off of Digital Rights Managed CDs. If copying CD music is going to be illegal, why is the government collecting money from the product for an illegal activity? I'm satisfied that the current levy is helping to compensate artists from illegitimate copying, and no new law is required to prevent me and other people from making sensible backups of our legal music, software, and movie collections.

    Your representation in the House of Commons on this matter is greatly appreciated by me, and other supporters of personal liberty and innovation in the arts. I look forward to hearing from you.

    Sincerely,
    my name
  • Sovereignty (Score:3, Insightful)

    by famazza (398147) <fabio DOT mazzarino AT gmail DOT com> on Sunday May 01, 2005 @05:59PM (#12401284) Homepage Journal

    See more at wikipedia [wikipedia.org] here [wikipedia.org].

    How can US government be respected as a democracy if it can't respect its own neighbor's sovereignty?

    It's not only about sovereignty, it's also about democracy; US can't even respect Canadian democracy. If the legitimate democratic Canadian Government decided that DMCA isn't apropriate for Canadian People it's US' duty to respect Canadian Government decision as strongly as it fights for democracy in Middle East.

    It's about time to the US Government to understand that THE WORLD must be democratic, not only countries. It's about time to the US Government understand that it's necessary to respect the laws and the decisions made by the United Nations.

  • by iSeal (854481) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @06:12PM (#12401422)
    Here's the difference between the US and Canada in Copyright reforms: The American comittee on Copyright Reforms is Sen. Orrin Hatch. He was payed $179,000 in 2004 by the RIAA/MPAA. The members of the Canadian comittee on Copyright reforms, on the other hand, were not given any noticeable contributions by the entertainment industries. For one, corporations are limited into how much they can donate, for another such conflict of interest wouldn't be allowed. So who'se reforms are you likely to believe to be lest biast? The opinion of the side who was payed nearly 200 grand by a party that voices one specific view, or the opinion of the side that wasn't bribed.
  • by Graemee (524726) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @06:49PM (#12401785)
    I seem to remember a small revolution started 200+ years ago when some empire taxed without representation. "Strong" IP laws like the DCMA and other corporate friendly laws are nothing short of taxation. A corporate tax for the people and by the companies through the law makers they buy.

    I find it humorous that the very people that started the revolution are the "empire" and those who rejected the first revolution now are the revolutionaries.

    Personally, I'd love to turn off the natural gas and electricity to you thankless assholes and sell it to the Chinese.
  • by El-Kelvinator (759973) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @07:03PM (#12401901) Homepage
    This just might have stemmed from the Softwood Lumber dispute. And the live cattle ban that the US has in place as well. A 'tit for tat' if you will.

    As for softwood, an International Court has ruled that the US is illegaly charging tariffs on Canadian Softwood lumber crossing the border.
    As for the live cattle ban, what a farce, the border is not closed, Americans are buying the cattle here in Canada, having them processed, and then shipping the products over the border, to their huge profit gains. And dont get me started on the lax USDA' BSE testing. Sad to say, but you Americans are eating some very tainted beef products. Some of you are crazy enough as it is, now you get to sue your beef provider chain. Have fun. Lawsuits work for you, not for the rest of the world. Especially not us Canadians.

    So, how does this lead to Canadian law not recognising the DMCA, well, our asshats think your asshats made a pretty stoopid law. So we wont put into place the same thing. We have laws protecting copyrighted works. nuff said. Copyright theft, is copyright theft. We have laws for that. We don't need the rest of the totalitarian threats behind the Act. Besides, in Canada, its not illegal to download copyrighted works, partly because, that act is not against the law here. It is against the law to upload copyrighted works. And that works for us.


    Much akin to your Patriot Act. What a crock. Its called "Freedom of Speech". Besides, the terrorists we do have here, are probably tax paying citizens anyway, they drive our cabs, our busses, and they clean our offices. We don't have many Mexicans or Puerto Ricans here. Something about the cold...

    It's bad enough that SOX got rammed down our throats. This is just another way for Canadians to say "Not in our Land"
  • by bigberk (547360) <bigberk@users.pc9.org> on Sunday May 01, 2005 @07:13PM (#12402012)
    Here is an article [sysdesign.ca] describing the proposed changes to Canadian copyright law, as well as the background -- industry lobby from the USA. This article is pulled from the Digital Copyright Canada [digital-copyright.ca] web site which is trying to organize citizens feedback to politicians, with respect to the DMCA in Canada.
  • by Husgaard (858362) on Sunday May 01, 2005 @07:33PM (#12402216)
    All countries in the EU have to adhere to DMCA-like legislation. And my country has to adhere to worse legislation due to US pressure.

    I am lucky that I cannot get jailed for viewing a legally purchased DVD under Linux. Our parliament didn't directly implement that in the law, but put an exception in the law comments that (I hope) will keep me out of jail while viewing legally purchased content with an non-approved DVD viewer.

    That legislation was imposed on the EU from the US and US corporations.

    Another law change was imposed specifically on our country after a threath of US trade restrictions through the WTO. This law change makes it possible for copyright holders to raid my private home if it is "probable" that I may have violated a copyright (or patent, or trademark). No need to get the police involved, a "probable violation" for a non-criminal offence is enough to get my private home raided.

    In particular the last law change made it clear to me why so many people around the globe hate the US because they think the US tries to impose their views on them. This gave me a better understanding of why a lot of US-foreign people think the US is imperialistic, and condome terrorist actions.

    I still do not concome terrorist actions, but I hate the US government now (fortunately not the US people although they are supposed to have democratically have selected their government), and understand why some people want to retailate against the US.

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