Utah Governor Signs Net-Porn Bill 941
All Names Have Been writes "House bill 260 has been signed into law by Utah's governor. It creates a list of websites that are not 'safe for children' and forces ISPs to block these sites for those who request it.
In addition, content providers who host or create content in Utah for profit must now rate their websites or face 3rd degree felony charges.
A similar law in Pennsylvania was struck down last year." (See this earlier story, too.)
Re:Wow! (Score:1, Informative)
Re:Utah makes TX and FL look good some times (Score:5, Informative)
I am personally against this form of censorship (but for some reason I was attacked ceaselessly in the last story on this bill), but it's a logical leap to say that they're outlawing anything.
For once, the first amendment sabre rattling... (Score:3, Informative)
The controversial bill . . . will require ISPs to block access to websites deemed "harmful to minors" on request. This blacklist will be drawn up by the state's Attorney General.
Poppycock. Clearly, the first amendment protects free speech - and this is a clear abridgement of this right. Just because perhaps most of the good citizens of Utah don't agree with their children being able to view pornography does not justify this move. Of course, I'm not the only one to think this way and hopefully this law will be struck down as in these other cases:
Groups such as the American Civil Liberties Union go further and warn the bill violates the US Constitution's First Amendment on free speech and the Commerce Clause. Six other states have had similar legislation ruled unconstitutional, resulting in huge legal bills for residents, Media Coalition director David Horowitz told the Salt Lake City Tribune.
Meh, thank goodness I don't pay taxes in those states. Stupid legislators.
On Request. (Score:5, Informative)
on request.
ON REQUEST.
This is not going to block every user from playboy.com. It will give people access to a list of websited to filter ON REQUEST.
American's love their State's Rights (Score:2, Informative)
This isn't about any sort of Freedom of Speech issue. No one is banning the creation of internet porn inside the state. That is still covered by the Freedom of Speech clause. However, access to such is not a right, at least to those of a certain philosophical mind.
I hope that there is no further erosion of the concept of State's Rights as fallout from this.
Just to be clear (Score:2, Informative)
Not that I think this law is a good idea, but it's easy to read a bit fast and mistake it for something even worse.
HAve you actually read the bill? (Score:5, Informative)
This being the Internet (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Utah makes TX and FL look good some times (Score:5, Informative)
They didn't BAN porn sites (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Utah as a religious dictatorship (Score:5, Informative)
So to those who have more familiarity with the region I have two questions.
I'm a "Mormon [mormon.org]", or more accurately, a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
1) Did this legislation come about as a result of the elders in the church?
Absolutely not. The Church stays strictly out of politics, except where a serious moral issue is involved, and then only the moral at issue is taught, but the vote and the law is up to the members individually.
And 2) Is this basically an accurate summation of Mormon politics?
No. Even among the members of the Church, it is a matter that often brings up discussion (sometimes heated) as to whether or not laws to restrict rights to behave immorally should be made. But this is not Church mandate or policy. It's up to the members.
If so, that seems scary to me. I wouldn't want a society where there is so much homogenity, even if everyone were basically like me.
On the contrary, the Church is only homogenous in that we share certain core beliefs [mormon.org]. I'm often amazed at how much variety fits within the Church. I disagree with political and ethical views with many good, active members of the Church that I know. The Church encourages us to seek out answers for ourselves.
In conclusion, be sure to research "the Mormons" using legitimate sources. That means: if you want to know what we "Mormons" believe in, ask a good, practicing Mormon.
Re:Utah as a religious dictatorship (Score:4, Informative)
Re:WRONG! (Score:5, Informative)
Actually, it's not just dildos, but novelty items.
Cities with Bans on Pornography Being Shipped to them
Jacksonville, Florida
Tallahassee, Florida
Indianapolis, Indiana
Cincinnati, Ohio
Memphis, Tennessee
Austin, Texas
Dallas, Texas
Houston, Texas
San Antonio, Texas
Waco, Texas
States with Some kind of law
Alabama
Arkansas
Georgia (Novelty Restriction Only)
Kansas (Novelty Restriction Only)
Mississippi
Utah
Texas (Statewide Novelty Restriction)
Zip Codes:
Texas:
76035 thru 76199
Louisiana (Lincoln Parish):
71001
71227
71234
71235
71241
71245
71270
71272
71273
71275
If there are corrections to this list, or whatnot, please respond below.
From the mouth of a Utah ISP owner/operator (Score:2, Informative)
On Tue, Mar 22, 2005 at 02:59:20PM -0600, Rachael Treu wrote:
> How, exactly, *did* this pass, anyway?
Any bill with "anti-pornography" as its title is going to be a freight train
in the Utah legislature. Nobody is going to get in front of it for fear of
being portrayed as "pro-pornography".
I knew this sobering fact early on in the life of this bill. In its original
form, it would have used IP addresses for blocking and would have introduced
criminal penalties on ISPs if anything managed to slip by. Regardless of
whether the ISP's filter was being circumvented or not.
The bill's sponsor was good in working with me, the only ISP here that
knew or was willing to come out against the bill. However, I was well aware
that all I could strive for was to reduce the ISP impact of the bill, not make
large deletions or changes. There were also a handful of individuals here who
had direct experience with commercial software who were appalled at the nature
of the bill and also worked against it. Large nationwide ISPs, who were
involved in discussions early on, were strangely silent, instead letting the
Internet Alliance write a letter for them.
I do not believe the Attorney General's office here knows what they are
signing up for. You may remember they had a "porn-czar" a few years back
whose position was dissolved over lack of funding. Somehow the AG believes
that maintaining and arbitrating an Internet blacklist will be easier and
cheaper.
In the end the bill itself doesn't have a big impact on this ISP's business.
We have used Dansguardian for many years now along with URLblacklist.com for
our customers that request filtering. The fact that its lists and software
are open for editing and inspection is the reason I chose this over other
commercial methods.
This bill is a waste of time and money. It also does further damage to the
Utah tech industry, portraying it as an idiotic backwater. Please do not
generalize and think everyone here agrees with the methods promoted by a
select few.
Re:Utah as a religious dictatorship (Score:2, Informative)
Update from Utah (Score:5, Informative)
The problem is when any group is a vast majority of the population, They start to do funny things. Especially when the defining charactoristic is something that you cannot apply scientific rigor to. This is the problem with 'Utah Mormons" - yes, they do tend to act differently than Mormons outside of Utah/Idaho.
This is why Democracy is a lousy form of government. It's only real asset, is that it takes longer to corrupt than most other forms of government.
And yes, IAA Mormon. Utah is not 'backward' (or advanced..) It just suffers from too much group-think. That it is Mormon group-think is less important.
Re:Utah as a religious dictatorship (Score:2, Informative)
After reading the number of posts to your original post, let me share with you something about the mormon religion -- it is certainly one of the most fucked up out there, imo. This is from multiple internet reading sources, and interaction between my old girlfriends (now deceased) family.
For the uninformed -- if you want to learn about mormonism from people who USED to be mormons and have been able to get themselves out of the fucked up circle that they teach -- check out http://www.exmormon.org/
The mormon religion (including all practicing members, because to BE a practicing member you are part of the teaching and administration staff of the church itself) are VERY good at marketing their religion. They are VERY good at telling you how great it is and how wonderful their family operates. But ask anyone who was mormon growing up how fucked up the religion is and they will tell you.
I am saying this as someone who grew up presbyterian and am now athiest. It is nothing even close to similar.
Brushfireb
Re:Utah as a religious dictatorship (Score:3, Informative)
Absolutely not. The Church stays strictly out of politics, except where a serious moral issue is involved, and then only the moral at issue is taught, but the vote and the law is up to the members individually.
Explain Ezra Taft Benson's affilation with the Birch sociecty then; not to mention his political appointments. How about the bank that Joseph Smith founded to print money? Who was the governer of Navoo? What about the law of consecration and Brigham Young's confescation of all wealth (or the Nation of Deseret, for that matter)?
But this is not Church mandate or policy. It's up to the members.Including a majority of the Utah state government, of course. What of a church that routinely gets such perks as the land swap for the "reflecting pool" in downtown Salt Lake (complete with a censoship zone); or how about the temple ceremony, in which members swear to uphold their leaders on penalty of death? Here are some quotes [i4m.com] by the church's prophets, seers and revelators on the subject.
On the contrary, the Church is only homogenous in that we share certain core beliefs [mormon.org].
Wow, that list doesn't even scratch the surface of what I was taught while growing up in the church:
- All religions apart from Mormonism are an "abomination [lightplanet.com]" in the sight of God
- People of "dark skin" were less valiant in the pre-existence, so God cursed them [truthandgrace.com] in this life
- American Indians are really errant Jews, who lost the gospel when they rebeled against God
- There are three levels of heaven, and you can only get to the highest level by practicing polygamy [ldshistory.net]; then you will be a God and have your own planet
- John the Beloved and the Three Nephites [cedarfort.com] are eternal beings that roam the planet, even today, doing the work of God (and the prieshood needed to be restored through Joseph Smith... why exactly?)
- Joseph Smith could translate a common Egyptian Funeral Book, to find that it contained extensive writings by father Abraham [irr.org]
- Homosexuality is a disase that you must suffer for [byu.edu] (I wonder when the 1978-esque "oops, my bad, blacks can have the priesthood now [teleport.com]" gay revelation will come). Masturbation [lds-mormon.com] is almost as bad.
And on, and on, and on. Some good books include Krakauer's "Banner under Heaven", Lason's "By his own Hand, on Papyrus", and Palmer's "Insider's View of Mormon Origins".To be fair, the church has changed dramatically over the past 50 years, and it continues to evolve into a more mainstream puritanical protestant sect (I bet Joseph Smith is rolling in his grave). Most of the members are people of high quality; heck, all my extended family are still members. They are generally great people to know, associate with and love. Despite that, I just get ruffled when the church portrayed as something that it really isn't; I did enough of that on my 2-year mission with the ultra-simplistic 6 discussions.
If you are interested in apologetic responses to any of the above, feel free to visit the FAIR website [fairlds.org].
Re:Utah as a religious dictatorship (Score:5, Informative)
For example, when the gay marriage proposition was up for vote in California, the Mormon church organized a massive door-to-door campaign to try to deny the gays their right to marry.
Your parent poster said "except where a serious moral issue is involved", which this is.
Being a Democrat in the Mormon church all but seals your prospects of holding influential positions in the organization.
James E. Faust is the 2nd Councelor in the First Presidency, which translates roughly into "3rd in command". He is Democratic [state.ut.us].
Apparently you've never sat in an Elder's Quorum meeting when they pass around a petition to stop a race track from being constructed in your town
I have never once been in an Elder's Quorum meeting where they passed around anything like that.
As they say, you learn more about a man from his enemies than his friends.
Unfortunately, enemies often are convinced of the truth of half truths, so they are not good sources of information.
Re:Britannica? (Score:2, Informative)
Serves me right for posting from memory!
Re:so basically... (Score:3, Informative)
The LDS Church is a cult, nothing more. (Score:1, Informative)
Furthermore, the DOCTOR who did the research was a bishop in the LDS church himself. He was excommunicated by his church for his work. Dr. Simon Southerton was a professor at BYU, but left after he realized that the Book of Mormon was nothing more than the imaginations of Joseph Smith.
I just have one question for the hardcore Mormons who refuse to believe in scientific fact: how did the 14-year-old Smith manage to translate the gold plates from an unintelligible ancient language into english? Or where did they go for that matter? Surely the man would have not lost the gold plates, considering just their historical importance and not their theological importance.
If you have not heard about Dr. Southerton, here's USA Today's article on the subject, for starters. http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/2004-07-26-dna-
Simple, targetted solution (Score:3, Informative)
It's not about whether an adult wants to go there or not - it's about whether an adult has the means to ensure their children don't go there.
This can be done with whitelisting (children are only allowed to see specific web sites, and receive e-mail from specific addresses). Simple and effective.
No need for draconian laws or turning society into a kindergarden.
Re:Thanks Utah! (Score:5, Informative)
They dodged the really difficult part (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Is this REALLY the end of the world? (Score:3, Informative)
Check sections 1a and 3 below. They seem to indicate that URL, DNS or IP are the options for the AG and that the list must be electronically accessible. DNS servers would fit all that and be an easy way to manage it, but yeah, they're are plenty of other options as well.
7-5-19. Adult content registry.
(1) As used in this section:
(a) "Access restricted" means access restricted as defined in Section 76-10-1230
(b) "Consumer" means a consumer as defined in Section 76-10-1230
(c) "Content provider" means a content provider as defined in Section 76-10-1230
(d) "Hosting company" means a hosting company as defined in Section 76-10-1230
(e) "Service provider" means a service provider as defined in Section 76-10-1230
(2) The attorney general, in consultation with other entities as the attorney general
considers appropriate, shall:
(a) create a database, called the adult content registry, consisting of a list of content
providers' sites, that shall be based on a Uniform Resource Locator address, domain name, and
Internet Protocol address or a similar addressing system, that:
(i) are added to the database under Subsection (2)(b); and
(ii) provide material harmful to minors that is not access restricted;
(b) add a content provider site to the adult content registry only if the attorney general
determines that the content provider is providing content that contains material harmful to minors
that is not access restricted;
(c) when the attorney general determines that a content provider site should be placed on
the adult content registry, if the content provider lists e-mail contact information, the attorney
general shall notify the content provider and hosting company, if available, by e-mail:
(i) that the content provider is providing content that contains material harmful to minors
that is not access restricted;
(ii) that the attorney general will place the content provider site on the adult content
registry five business days after the notice is sent;
(iii) that the content provider can avoid being placed on the adult content registry if any
material harmful to minors is access restricted; and
(iv) of the steps necessary for the content provider or hosting company to apply to be
removed from the adult content registry;
(d) (i) if notification is required under Subsection (2)(c), place a content provider site on the adult content registry five business days after the day on which the division makes the
required notification; or
(ii) if notification is not required under Subsection (2)(c), place a content provider site on
the adult content registry five business days after the day on which the attorney general
determines that the content provider should be placed on the adult content registry; and
(e) if requested by a content provider, remove a content provider from the adult content
registry within two business days from the day on which the attorney general determines that the
content provider no longer provides material harmful to minors that is not access restricted.
(3) The attorney general shall make the adult content registry available for public
dissemination in a readily accessible access restricted electronic format.
(4) The attorney general shall establish a system for the reporting of material transmitted
to a consumer in violation of Section 76-10-1232.
Re:Utah as a religious dictatorship (Score:4, Informative)
I assume you're referring to the Urim and Thummim? These were not spectacles, but more like oddly shaped rocks and I don't know how he used them but I don't think he put them over his eyes. Or maybe he did, I don't see why that matters.
Why do Mormons wear long underwear with Masonic symbols on it?
The garments are symbolic of a few things, and particularly they are a symbol of our devotion and obedience. As for the Masonic symbols, what about them? Our rituals are supposed to be much like those of the ancient church. I don't know that much about the Masons, but I gather that they're supposed to have preserved such things, and therefore that there would be overlap seems perfectly reasonable.
Do you believe that Native Americans rather than originating from crossing over from Siberia to Alaska are a lost tribe of the Israelites?
Sort of. As far as I know, there isn't too much difinitive information about this in the church. We definitely believe that Isrealites came over to North America at about 600BC, and it seems to be a popular Mormon belief that current Native Americans are descended from these, but that is not entirely clear. It is possible that there was interbreeding, or that the Isrealites died off entirely.
Do you believe that blacks are the descendants of Cain; an associate of Lucifer as stated by your church?
I guess so, but we most definitely DO believe that one is responsible for one's own sins, not the sins of one's father. Today, there are blacks all over the world who are upstanding members of our church (blacks were given the right to the priesthood in 1978).
Also, even if God set apart black people as Cain's seed and marked them with black skin and said they were not worthy of the priesthood until fairly recently, that does not mean that church members were ever given any excuse to hate black people.
Do you believe you will rule your own planet when you die?
Sort of, yeah, though it's a lot more complicated than that. We actually believe that the most faithful of us will go to the highest level of Heaven after the Millennium (1000 years of Christ ruling this Earth), after which we will continue to grow and learn and then eventually become Gods of our own planets/universes just like the God of this planet/universe.