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The Courts Government Media Television News

Court Says FCC Out-of-Bounds With Digital TV 481

USA4034 writes "A U.S. appeals court on Tuesday stated that regulators had overstepped their authority by imposing a rule designed to limit the copying of digital television programs." From the article: "The FCC rule aims to limit people from sending copies of digital television programs over the Internet. The FCC has said copyright protections are needed to help speed the adoption of digital television."
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Court Says FCC Out-of-Bounds With Digital TV

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  • by general_re ( 8883 ) on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @07:07PM (#11750107) Homepage
    In order to challenge a blatantly unconstitutional and unjust law, I must first become its victim, because I cannot challenge a law until I have been brought up on charges based on that law.

    False, moderation notwithstanding. The term you're looking for is "facial challenge".

  • by Kentsusai ( 837912 ) <kentsusai@@@gmail...com> on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @07:09PM (#11750125)
    Yes you are very right.

    That is because America has a legal system based on the Common Law. Just like England and Australia.

    Countries based on a Civil Law system such as France allow people to get rulings from a court prior to them performing an act. For example, if you were in France you could go to a court and ask "Can I download this file?" You will be given a definite "Yes" or "No" and that statement made by the court will be binding.

    In order to solve this problem, Common Law jurisdictions have to develop an "Interpretations Court". What this court would do is allow people to ask whether it is legal to do what they want. Just like France.

    The problem with implementing such a system is that it may be unconstitutional. The reason why it would be unconstituional is because the users of the lower court would want a binding affirmation, one that could not be overturned by the Supreme Court. This would be unsound in the terms of the Constitution. The Supreme Court is not meant to be bound by lower courts.

  • Re:Why? (Score:3, Informative)

    by Phil Karn ( 14620 ) <karn@@@ka9q...net> on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @07:10PM (#11750134) Homepage
    The obvious answer: because they can cram in far more channels with digital than with analog, and thereby sell more commercial time.

    It's amazing how many digital music services still use the line "CD-quality" to describe their programs when the original CD data has been heavily compressed. It may (or may not) sound reasonably good, but by definition it is not "CD quality".

    The content cartel has no trouble spooking Congress with this "CD-quality" line when they wring their hands about peer-to-peer filesharing, even though the vast majority of music and movie files on P2P are very heavily compressed. Even the legal, for-pay services like iTunes and eMusic compress heavily. (There are a few notable exceptions, such as Magnatune, which make FLAC files available for download.)

    The content cartel even managed a few years back to convince Congress to add "digital transmission" to the list of rights reserved to the copyright holder, over and above those that apply to ordinary analog broadcasting. This has resulted in substantially higher royalty rates for digital music broadcasters. Perhaps somebody should point this out to any Congressmen still wondering why digital broadcasting hasn't taken off yet.

  • Re:except that (Score:5, Informative)

    by theLOUDroom ( 556455 ) on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @07:14PM (#11750170)
    what about all those rules re; radio interferance and cell phone & wifi antenna/design registrations.

    is that not dictate how electronic devices must be made


    NO IT"S NOT.

    The FCC (generally) only has the authority to dictate the use of the electromagnetic spectrum.
    THEY DON'T TELL MANUFACTURERS HOW TO BUILD THINGS.
    They don't tell them how to build Xboxes, cellphones, etc.
    They tell they that you device must be designed in such a way that it will meet with their regulations on the EM spectrum.

    This is all they are allowed to do, BY LAW.
    If "the people" (a term I use very loosely...believe me) decide that the FCC should actually be able to tell manufactures to respect the broadcast flag, the a law must be passed saying they have the authority to do so.
    This is what the cellphone industry pushed through for scanners and thing is what the television industry will have to do:
    Buy a law.
    Isn't democracy grand?
  • by kelnos ( 564113 ) <bjt23@nOSpam.cornell.edu> on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @07:19PM (#11750218) Homepage
    Or better yet, the digital TV mandate shouldn't specify a resolution at all.
    IIRC, it doesn't, and some DTV broadcasters are indeed sending standard def signals over their allotted frequencies. The mandate from the FCC has nothing to do with broadcast quality, and everything to do with the signal type. The only requirement is that broadcasters use the newly-allocated frequencies, and that they use the digital ATSC standard, and one of the approved modulations. It's digital vs. analog here, not quality.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @07:23PM (#11750254)
    The ACLU has lawyers that represent the people that have been harmed by a law. They can not arbitrarily challenge a law. Article 3 of the constitution requires a plantiff in a federal cases to be "standing to sue"
  • by cmclean ( 230069 ) on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @07:24PM (#11750263) Homepage Journal
    This morning's oral arguments (along with a bunch of other stuff) were blogged by an "informal law student" here. [luminousvoid.net] Some useful insight into what's happening behind the news reports.
  • by bnenning ( 58349 ) on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @07:34PM (#11750399)
    As much as I hate to play devil's advocate, the rampant adoption of PVRs has left television in a sad state. Advertisers are no longer willing to pay top dollar for airtime out of fear that their commercials will not be watched

    One word: tough. More words:
    There has grown in the minds of certain groups in this country the idea that just because a man or corporation has made a profit out of the public for a number of years, the government and the courts are charged with guaranteeing such profit in the future, even in the face of changing circumstances and contrary to public interest. This strange doctrine is supported by neither statue or common law. Neither corporations or individuals have the right to come into court and ask that the clock of history be stopped, or turned back.


    - Robert Heinlein, Life Line, 1939
  • by rgmoore ( 133276 ) * <glandauer@charter.net> on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @07:52PM (#11750591) Homepage
    Seeing the word "God" repeated through out the Declaration of Independance and the Constitution may cause you to think that - because, of course, no other religions call their higher power just plain old "God".

    Actually, I don't see "God" repeated throughout the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution. The word "God" appears exactly once in the Declaration of Independence (in the phrase "Nature and Nature's God") and zero times in the Constitution. If anything, I'd say that makes "God" conspicuous by its absence.

  • by Surt ( 22457 ) on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @08:09PM (#11750753) Homepage Journal
    Buy a better dvd player. There are a lot out there that will skip any content regardless of the flags set on it by the manufacturer.
  • Re:Why? (Score:3, Informative)

    by pla ( 258480 ) on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @08:20PM (#11750859) Journal
    In my experience, digital isn't really that much higher quality than analog.

    Then you either had a really high quality TV before the HDTV-era, or only watch NTSC-upsampled-to-HDTV-and-called-digital (actually pretty common, the majority of the broadcast "HDTV" channels do exactly that).

    Personally, I went from a typical 29" NTSC TV to a mid-range 720p HDTV, and just watching progressive scan DVDs (aka 480p), I notice a drastic difference in quality. Not just some subtle improvement, but a night-and-day difference. And for console gaming, let me tell you, component-in 720p-capable games make the older generation of consoles look little better than an etch-a-sketch by comparison.
  • by gabebear ( 251933 ) on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @08:56PM (#11751157) Homepage Journal
    I haven't heard about this before, but I know it's illegal to listen/watch anything but the state's broadcasts

    links:
    http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/asiapcf/02/24/nk orea.tv/ [cnn.com]
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4157121.st m [bbc.co.uk]
    http://www2.gol.com/users/coynerhm/north_korea_tv_ nation.htm [gol.com]
    http://nkfreedom.org/important_nk_topics.html [nkfreedom.org]
    http://web.amnesty.org/ [amnesty.org]
  • by Marful ( 861873 ) on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @09:21PM (#11751365)
    In highschool, my economics teacher also taught 2 periods of government.

    One of things you are required to teach in California in the Government class, is that you DO NOT have to recite or participate in the pledge of allegiance, and you are supposed to learn about the original case that led to the supreme court ruling this unconstitutional.

    One day, I was busy putting together my business plan that fell apart in my backpack during the pledge, and the teacher decided to make an example out of me, and gave me a referal for not performing the pledge.

    He kept harrasing and gave me a referal every day. The administration also started harrassing me, and the vice principal went on record stating "The school board is going to review this case and see whether or not the supreme court ruling is relevant to this situation."

    Despite the fact that several other faculty members (including the other governemnt and a history teacher) protested and lodged complaints with the administration on the actions being taken.

    Some people may of heard of my High school; El Modena. They are most known for this:

    http://www.asbj.com/2000/07/0700schoollaw.html

    So, you do NOT in fact have a right to refuse to participate in the pledge. This is entirely dependant on the whims, ideals and opinion of the school. And if you are in a pro-christian school enviroment, you are either an ally, or an enemy.

    The Separation of Church and State is in the constitution for a reason. Not because its a sophisticated peace of dialogue with some words that most have to look up in the dictionary.

    But because the founding fathers left a country for the very reason they wished to include that passage.

  • by VValdo ( 10446 ) on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @09:26PM (#11751410)
    ...zero times in the Constitution

    Down at the bottom... (bold is mine)

    "Done in convention by the unanimous consent of the states present the seventeenth day of September in the year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and eighty seven and of the independence of the United States of America the twelfth."

    I've seriously seen the above used to argue that God's divinity is recognized in the Constitution. (counter-argument: names of days and months in the Constitution recognize divinity of ancient Greek and Roman gods.)

    Today is George Washington's bday.

    W
  • by hawk ( 1151 ) <hawk@eyry.org> on Tuesday February 22, 2005 @10:56PM (#11752000) Journal
    I am a lawayer, but this is not legal advice. If you get legal advice on slashdot, your flag bit is wrong.

    I'm not surprised at all by the ruling that the FCC overstepped, we've been seeing quite a lot of rulings recently that agencies have overstepped their authority. Broadly speaking, administrative agencies cannot make choices *about* policy, but ponly about how to *implement* the policy given by Congress (or state legislatures). To significantly deviate from what can be done with other technologies is a policy choice, not an implementation choice, and would require a charge from Congress.

    What i find odd is that the court ruled on these merits while still "concerned" about jurisdiction.

    And that's when I looked closer.

    The court didn't *say* anything today. Judges ask questions during oral arguments, some of which suggest a position. Often, the same judge will ask questions which make it sound like he holds conflicting positions. That's normal.

    That said, the statement "You crossed the line," is a bit strong even for oral arguments, and does suggest that *that judge* is strongly leaning in thhat direction.

    Still, though, the court has done *nothing* at this time.

    I would be surprised, though, if the ruling doesn't come out before July 1. With two judges apparently leaning in a direction, the usual standards for a restraining order against enforcement of the law would seem to have been met.

    As far as standing, I would expect (but certainly wouldn't bet my house on it!) that a single actual consumer as a petitioner would have standing to sue--the inability to buy devices currently on the market should be a sufficient real harm. An "assoiacion" is a much larger stretch. The courts are frequently hostile to such standing. That said, I can't tell from the slipshod reporting who the other petitioneers are. I'd be surprised if the lawyers for petitioners didn't bother to include at least one real person as a named plaintiff.

    hawk, esq.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday February 23, 2005 @01:33AM (#11752817)
    And when one Googles "facial challenge" one comes across the transcript of National Endowment for Arts vs. Finley which says, among other things:
    "A facial challenge to a legislative Act is, of course, the most difficult challenge to mount successfully, since the challenger must establish that no set of circumstances exists under which the Act would be valid."
  • by Christopher Cashell ( 2517 ) on Wednesday February 23, 2005 @09:04AM (#11754384) Homepage Journal
    Really?

    Can you point out who it was that "voted" for the broadcast flag?

    Oh, wait, that's right. It wasn't voted on. It was mandated by the FCC.

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