What's Going On in Canada? 592
Jack Action writes "Up in Canada, the Privacy Commissioner of the province of British Columbia is recommending an immediate freeze on all outsourcing of public data to US-connected firms, Reuters and the CBC are reporting. After extensive consultations, the Privacy Commissioner has found that the USA Patriot Act threatens the private data of citizens even if they don't live in the USA (repeat: non-Americans are at risk). You can visit the Commissioners website, and download a summary or the full report." And reader digity writes "The long-standing Canadian battle on grey-market satellite dishes took a surprising turn in a Quebec courtroom yesterday. The grounds: freedom of expression. Yet another reason to come to the Great White North!"
Re:Citizens of USA aren't americans ? (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Oh Canada (Score:5, Informative)
So no, I wouldn't say that the grass is always greener.
Re:Typo in article headline (Score:5, Informative)
US and European worries. (Score:5, Informative)
Sounds good but commissioner Bolkestein considered the US statements about data protection sufficient. .
For this great feat he has just earned himself the Dutch Big Brother Award for 2004.
See Bits of Freedom [www.bof.nl]
The European Parliament has called on the European Court of Justice to declare the agreement null and void, a ruling by the Court can at the earliest be expected by next year.
Wrong about the UK (Score:5, Informative)
Phillip.
Re:DTV (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Canada Vs. America: Rights of it's Citizens (Score:5, Informative)
The WMA was only ever invoked three times in Canadian history. World War 1, World War 2, and the FLQ Crisis (mentioned by parent). When it was used during the FLQ crisis it stirred up a lot of shit, because it was abused. People all across the country were arrested just because they were french or black or whatever. So in 85 the WMA was replaced with the Emergencies Act [justice.gc.ca]. Its a much tamer piece of legislation, and doesn't allow the government to superceed the entire Charter of Rights and Freedoms. It does give them additional powers, like the ability to kick you out of your house and lay claim to your property, but you can't be arrested for no good reason (though you CAN be arrested for not complying with the government's new powers). Fortunatly the Emergencies act doesn't apply to the whole country (like the WMA did), only to the area(s) actually experiencing the emergency.
So yes, the potential for abuse is still there, but compared to the draconian mindfuck that was the War Measures Act, the Emergencies act is a fluffy white bunny. Which brings up the odd realization: Other countries are moving AWAY from being able to strip people of their rights... the US is moving towards it. Scary? I think yes.
Re:DTV (Score:5, Informative)
Yeah, for those who don't know, the grey market is where a Canadian sets up a subscription to DirecTV (or whatever) from the U.S., and sets up their dish in Canada. It only violates the content regulations and stuff. They're still paying their bill and everything.
For somebody who wants "ethnic" programming like Mexican Spanish content in Canada, it can be the only option, so I have a hard time faulting somebody for subscribing.
The reverse (U.S. resident getting a Canadian dish) applies as well. I'm not sure what Canada has that the U.S. isn't allowed to get though.
Now I think you could set yourself up to be pretty much impossible to track if you partner up with a friend on the other side of the border... you set up their dish and they set up your dish, you each pay for each other's subscriptions so that there's no money-trail. Just make sure your dish doesn't have advertising written on it :-)
If they're compatible, you might just be able to swap receivers...
Mod-chipping and stuff for free viewing is black-market... unless you're a cypherpunk or something and can't stand the thought of signals passing through your body without knowing what they mean. Yes, it's illegal to tune them in and decode them.
Not just Canada (Score:3, Informative)
The US is generally seen as a country with very little privacy protection.
Canada is not some bastion of freedom folks. (Score:3, Informative)
If Canada is being held-up as superior to America when it comes to freedom, compared to the United States, even in spite of recent attempts to limit freedom down there, then either people's definition of what freedom is has changed, or we have become so desparate as a civilization that we no longer know what up and what's down anymore. Canada is, socially, an extremely repressive country, especially these days. Forget about being an individual up here, coz it ain't on. If you do not conform to the prescribed standards, you are ostracized and marginalized. I see it all the time every day up here. We are not an innovative country, we don't like it. Anyone that tries to engage in it in Canada is looking for trouble, and it doesn't particularly matter what kind of innovation it is, they just don't like it here. You need only compare the Canadian and American constitutions to know what Canada is really all about. Americans have the "...right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness". Canadians have the "...right to peace, order, and good government". Wow, lucky us. Those are exactly the kind of conditions dictators have been providing since dictators have existed.
I once had an English professor of mine make the statement that "...people have this foolish notion that lifestyle is a human right". In other words, people have this crazy idea that they're allowed to live their lives as they wish (so long as they're not affecting others, of course), without fear of molestation from anyone. This man is about as deeply Establishment as anyone gets. He married into money, was born in Britain, has had a direct role in formulating federal and provincial government social policy in the past, has been the head of English departments in highschools and schoolboards. I could go on, because the list of his accomplishments is lenghty, and the reach of his influence is far, but you get the point.
Ask any average person in the middle class up here how they feel about a given controversial topic, and wonder at the conservative response you get. Speak in public say, in a cafe, about that same topic and observe the dirty "shut-the-fuck-up" looks you get. You are not entitled to your own opinion up here, or to even criticize. If you go there, you can expect direct, serious social consequences. Once I was talking, in a park, about a play my spouse and I had gone to see. I held a different view than everyone else about the central conflict in the story. Some lady that had been listening in, a complete stranger, had the audacity to approach me and order me to 'stop being so different, stop having a different opinion'.
THAT, my friends, IS Canada. Get in line, conform, and dont make a fuss. This attitude crosses generation, class, and gender lines. That is the truth of Canada and, in a greater sense, the world we live in today. If you are worried about your freedoms being taken away from you, my American friends, don't hold up Canada as a model of how things should be. Most Canadians regard indiviual freedom as dangerous, and only "OK" so long as they don't threaten the current established order. In other words, any antithetical opinion is automatically a threat, and must be quashed by any means neccessary.
Re:Canada Vs. America: Rights of it's Citizens (Score:3, Informative)
Guantanamo Bay is a bad example. I personally feel that what we're doing there is inexcusable, but it doesn't match your argument. You bring up two cases from Canada and the US where civil rights of citizens were violated, and one where those of foreign nationals were. You're better off pointing at the 3000 (I'm pulling that number out of memory from an NPR story) people who have been detained without due procedure and eventually let go (in some cases months later) without charges ever being brought. These are US citizens who were plucked out of ordinary lives in order to
THAT is your comparison.
If you're itching for another one... and you have a strong stomach, do a google search for the words "extraordinary rendition", but I warn you that if you're a citizen of the US and you had respect for your country's record on human rights, this information will not sit well with you (the term was introduced by Clinton's administration and the practice is being expanded by Bush's so don't give me that party-politics response either).
Re:Typo in article headline (Score:5, Informative)
Or maybe not ..... (Score:2, Informative)
Freedom of Speech? Canda has a wonderful section in its criminal code prohibiting willful promotion of hatred against identifiable groups (s. 319(2)) http://www.hrcr.org/safrica/limitations/r_keegstr
Just Google on "willful promotion of hatred" and "Canada" for examples on how this statute is being used. If I were to utter the phrase "Slashdot readers really need to get a life and maybe a girlfriend". That theoretically could fall under the Criminal Code
Then of course you will have to stomach:
Lower wages
Higher Taxes:
>50% of your income between Federal and Provincial taxes (if you're a technogeek like me and get paid for it)
Last time I looked, 9% Provincial sales tax (depending on the province) + 7% Federal GST on goods purchased in Canada.
Then there is of course the politics. If you like politics in the U.S. you will *love* them in Canada. Watching the proceedings in the House of Commons gives new meaning to the phrase "spirited debate".
Do you like unions in the U.S.? You'll love them in Canada. Think about what it means when the nurses go on strike, or the postal service, or
I could go on. Like any other country, Canada has its good as well as bad points. Make sure you understand what those are and can live with them before you pack up your bags and go.
Re:Go Bin Laden! (Score:5, Informative)
Oh, but it does. The US has over 700 military bases in over 130 countries, all strategically located of course, and another 6000 bases at home oriented towards exporting agression. There is an express military policy of being able to fight multiple engagements around the world simultaneously. That's shock and awe for you: the sudden realization that it is the american military, not the UN, that has a truly global presence. Pax Americana is here, and it is scary.
You can also look at the lobbying spirit with which american business is conducted around the globe; US foreign policy has a powerful mix of hard-ass negotiating government-to-government on behalf of corporate interests, and intergovernmental cooperation with a huge power imbalance (see above mention of bases). Combine that with the allure of consumption of US goods (including cultural forms), and you have a compromised position--you have to take it wherever they want to put it.
Re:Canada Vs. America: Rights of it's Citizens (Score:4, Informative)
I shall correct you if you're wrong. The premier at the time (not premiere) was Rene Levesque.
Duplesis was a right-wing nutter who was the premier of Quebec in the 1950s trying to run the province like it was his little fiefdom as well as keeping the population under the thumb of the Catholic Church. The court case that stopped his abuse of executive power to harass citizens is still used in constitutional cases [chrc-ccdp.ca] to this day.
Levesque was a chain-smoking left-wing nutter who was played for a fool by Trudeau during the repatriation process.
The Quebec Government was pretty miffed over the patriation deal, but I think those wounds are healed because the seperatist government of Quebec (PQ) has negotiated constitutional amendments in the 1990s to secularise schools in Montreal & Quebec City. I also think the rifts between the federal and provincial governments are healed more now that Quebec has a Liberal government.
Why you should think twice before heading to Canad (Score:3, Informative)
I must start off by saying that I love my beloved Canada -- but I just want to add a dose of realism to this discussion. Canada is not a freedom-lovers paradise by any means. We have our fair share of problems which don't happen to be in the spotlight as much as the USA transgressions on freedom because it's not so unusual.
(1) We don't have free speech in Canada.
Hate a group of people, and want to say it in public? You're breaking the law, as Hate Speech is a violation of the criminal code. That's right, you can get fined or thrown in jail for something you said because others find it hateful. Whether you agree with this or not, it's certainly not near the ideal of free speech attempted by the USA's first amendment.
(2) Our constitution has an exemption clause.
The USA Constitution is set in stone, and can only be overridden by an amendment which is a very difficult process. Canada's constitution has a built-in "or maybe not" clause, letting politicians willfully violate our Charter of Rights and Freedoms if they want to in a process much simpler than in the USA. Again, this has benefits as well as drawbacks, but there are no absolute protections for rights like the USA constitution enshrines.
(3) We have our own "anti-terror" violations of due process.
In the USA you have the PATRIOT act and Guantanemo Bay, but here in Canada we have "Security Certificates". These are used against Muslims -- er, make that evildoers -- who are suspected of terrorist activities. They are handed out by a secret court and a secret judge, and the accused is not allowed to see the charges levied against him or her.
(4) Our media regulator is trigger happy.
In the USA you've got Stern being targeted and fined by the FCC, but the situation in Canada is little better. We are far more liberal about nudity and sexuality -- it's not uncommon to see full male or female nudity on broadcast television and we have shows on our cable networks that need to be censored on USA cable networks. But if you say something deemed hateful, you're not welcome.
During the brief period Stern was broadcast here, he ran afoul of the hate crimes police for poking fun on French-Canadians. More recently, they tried to revoke the radio license of the most popular station in Quebec City because one of the DJs made some off-colour remarks that were deemed hateful.
Anyhow -- I want to reiterate that I love living in Canada, and that I prefer it to the USA. But many Americans are under the false belief that it is a paradise of freedom, but we have our own warts too and the full truth deserves to be out there so people can make informed decisions.
What! No English alternative!?! (Score:3, Informative)
In Days of yore,
From Britain's shore
Wolfe the dauntless hero came
And planted firm Britannia's flag
On Canada's fair domain.
Here may it wave,
Our boast, our pride
And joined in love together,
The thistle, shamrock, rose entwined,
The Maple Leaf Forever.
[CHORUS]
The Maple Leaf
Our Emblem Dear,
The Maple Leaf Forever.
God save our Queen and heaven bless,
The Maple Leaf Forever.
At Queenston Heights and Lundy's Lane
Our brave fathers side by side
For freedom's home and loved ones dear,
Firmly stood and nobly died.
And so their rights which they maintained,
We swear to yeild them never.
Our watchword ever more shall be
The Maple Leaf Forever
[CHORUS]
Our fair Dominion now extends
From Cape Race to Nootka Sound
May peace forever be our lot
And plenty a store abound
And may those ties of love be ours
Which discord cannot sever
And flourish green for freedom's home
The Maple Leaf Forever
[CHORUS]
Re:Canada Vs. America: Rights of it's Citizens (Score:3, Informative)
You missed paragraph 33, which allows a federal or provincial parliament to make any law they pass immune to the charter at will. The only restriction is that laws with that designation have to be renewed by a new vote of the legislature every five years or they expire.
Re:Other freedoms (Score:2, Informative)
This is not true. In this case, a policeman from the national hate crimes unit (part of the RCMP) mused on TV that the hate crime law could be used to investigate someone who made anti-American comments, like the lecturer. There was no invesitagtion, fine or anything like that
There was an immediate backlash in public opinion, and the RCMP officer retracted the statement the next day. It should be noted, this was also in the weeks after Sept 11th, which is probably why the lecturer was singled out.
The hate speech laws do limit free speech. But Canadians have a history of giving their government some heavy powers, but then seeing that they are almost never used. Political violence in Canada is almost unknown, and the democracy still functions to a degree that controversial actions recieve extensive debate.
Re:Other freedoms (Score:1, Informative)
First, I assume that the UBC lecturer that the poster is referring to is Sunera Thobani. Thobani was accused by a private individual of hate crimes and the police were obliged to investigate. However, Thobani was not charged.
Next, Canadians do not say "oh, but this type of speech shouldn't be protected anyways". In fact, Thobani's right to free speech was strongly supported by many Canadians, even by many who did not agree with her remarks.
Finally, the comment "they prefer to put their trust in the their government; we prefer to put our trust in the Constitution" belies an ignorance of Canadian society and law. In fact, Canada does have a constitution, one part of which is the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. And, like the American constitution, any law passed by the Canadian government must not contravene the Charter. There have been many "Charter-cases" where the fundamental rights and freedoms that all Canadians are entitled to has struck down or otherwise modified legislation. Gay marriage is just one such example.
(I have no idea what the poster was referring to with respect to the derogatory gay coworker case; I suspect that if the author actually provided a reference, we'd find that the actual details to be different than described.)
Re:You mean the crushing of free speech ? (Score:1, Informative)
Actually you certainly can say that homosecuality is immoral and sinful, absolutely you can say that, that is an opinion that you are free to have and express
You are incapable of being unprejudiced, from keeping your hate to yourself, so there are laws to protect the public.
You are obviously unaware of the white supremacist bastards that the law has taken down.
You are obviously unaware of the muslim leader in Vancouver who is under investigation for breaking the anti-hate laws for instilling hate against jews.
Re:Oh Canada (Score:1, Informative)
And I say this as a former Catholic, coming from a 99% Catholic country, who used to go to a Catholic high-school in Canada, who chooses to have his taxes go towards the public school system. My wife and kid are United Church, and I just don't give a damn about religion anymore.