Dept. of Homeland Security Enforces Expired Patent 1006
Fouquet writes "Apparently the Department of Homeland Security does not have enough to do in keeping the US safe, and now is enforcing copyright law as well. The AP reports that a toy store owner in Oregon was requested by Homeland Security officials to remove a potentially copyright-infringing Rubik's cube-like toy from her shelves. The patent for Rubik's cube was issued in 1980, and so it is expired."
Well if this is true... (Score:1, Insightful)
I was going to go for a first post, but now I am too scared to try!
And why are you people voting for Bush? (Score:1, Insightful)
Suuuuuuurrreee... It's just to prevent terrorism. For very wide definitions of 'terrorism'.
go figure (Score:5, Insightful)
So which is it? (Score:4, Insightful)
Trademark in the title, copyright in the summary, but a patent on the Rubik's cube. These are all different you know...
Huh? (Score:3, Insightful)
Apparently the Department of Homeland Security does not have enough to do in keeping the US safe, and now is enforcing copyright law as well.
The patent for Rubik's cube was issued in 1980, and so it is expired."
So, are we talking about a copyright, a trademark, or a patent?
rUSsiA (Score:5, Insightful)
DHS seems to have morphed (Score:5, Insightful)
Now the DHS seems to see its role as more than a simple anti-terrorist investigative agency. They think of themselves as another arm of Federal law enforcement. To some extent, they are correct. The role they play is vital to American national security, and to reach the goals of the agency it is mandatory that they have the ability to use law enforcement tactics.
However, to stretch the fairly narrow initial charter of the DHS to include such things as "defending the national economy" is nothing short of stupid and dangerous. When the DHS was formed, their purview only included possible terrorist attacks. Now it is expanded to include just about any crime that someone deems undesirable.
The government should not have many overlapping law enforcement agencies. Indeed, this is what led to the massive intelligence failure on 9/11 with the lack of communication between the various government agencies. The DHS would be better absorbed into the FBI as a anti-terror division than to continue expanding its powers unabated.
But wait... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Fear of powers (Score:2, Insightful)
I guess their justification is it was a crime in progress, in a public place, so they didn't need a warrant. What they should do is contact their local congressman and see if they can get him to yell at homeland security for this. Whatever else the average congressperson's deficiencies, they oftentimes are surprisingly good at intimidating bureaucrats, when they have the inclination.
Re:Uh huh (Score:5, Insightful)
Democracy is quietly dying because a buch of lazy people will happily pass the "Happy fluffy bunny (you'd be a nasty pinko liberal for not passing this) bill" without actually reading it and finding out that it disbands senate & congress and leaves all legislative & executive power in the hands of the president who now has an extended (life) term of office.
misleading to say DHS (Score:2, Insightful)
Whether or not trademarks were actually being violated is a another matter.
I'm not sure what's more frightening (Score:3, Insightful)
You have a chance to do something about it next Tuesday. Go vote.
We're going to have to change our name to the country formerly known as the land of the free.
Abuse of Power (Score:5, Insightful)
If we let these powermad tyrants have power, they will abuse it, and maybe apologize later, after the damage is done. We have to get rid of this unaccountable department immediately, and use our National Security system to protect us. Anyone know what is the difference is between "National" Security and "Homeland" Security? Or the Department of Defense, for that matter? We're turning into squalid East Germany, where every fifth German was a "security" henchman, controlling their neighbors through surveillence and intimidation.
Poster and AP clearly has no clue (Score:1, Insightful)
They mix match and mangle various laws and rumors to come up with this story.
There is nothing to see here, just random rumour and silliness.
Nothing to see here-Santa Arrested. (Score:1, Insightful)
This concerns Trademarks... (Score:3, Insightful)
Specifically, the trademark probably hasn't expired (in principle trademarks don't while you defend them); A rubiks cube (or anything similar) can't infringe upon copyright (unless you're crazy enough to consider it a medium for information).
I don't like whining about bad slashdot stories; but this really is poorly presented...
--Eamon
Re:Useless summary. (Score:3, Insightful)
The AP story very clearly states :
"Virginia Kice, a spokeswoman for Immigration and Customs Enforcement, said agents went to Pufferbelly based on a trademark infringement complaint filed in the agency's intellectual property rights center in Washington, D.C."
These agents, working for Customs enforcement, were doing there job as mandated by the law. Obviously there is a process in place within Customs to investigate intellectual property. If you don't think they should be doing that, then get involved and get the law changed, don't whine about the man trying to keep you down.
Of course the /. crowds sees DHS and they start jumping the gun about Anti-terrorism squads hunting down subversive Magic Cubes in violation of the PATRIOT Act.
Please try and apply some critical thinking skills here.
Re:And why are you people voting for Bush? (Score:2, Insightful)
Obviously this case is asinine, and I'd hate to think how many more instances similiar to this have occured. The real question is how do we fix the problem? Will Kerry if elected be able to do anything to dismantle or at least take some of the edge off the Patriot Act? If Bush is re-elected will the problem just get worse? Or is the problem just too large to fix?
-JM
Re:Huh? (Score:4, Insightful)
Either way, it really bugs me that homeland security is even thinking about anything besides terrorism. Why the hell are we paying agents to fly out to bumsville for a da## rubiks cube.. And if we're paying them to do that, why aren't we paying them to research things first? Perhaps the same researchers that decided there were WMD's in Iraq (though I think there must be somewhere.. still intelligence was bad enough we cant find them if they are there)..
Re:rUSsiA (Score:3, Insightful)
Oh, for god's sake. It's not that bad. If it were, there's about 200 newspapers that would be shut down already, for endorsing the political opponent of the president. You can still stand on the street corner and hold up a big sign that says what a dickless coward you think the president is; I know, because I see people doing it all the time here in Columbia, Missouri.
Where are you now, exactly? Germany, looks like, from your URL? Germany is cool. I'd like to visit again. Did a day in Berlin and it was neat. I don't know what we have over here that they don't have in Germany, so I don't know why you'd want to visit. But for god's sake we're still the land of the free (markets). Let's keep a little perspective, people, and stay realistic. Nobody's going to get in the way of a European coming over here to spend their money, after all.
And I would point out that yours is the country that still restricts free expression, at least if you choose to express yourself in the manner of Nazis. (Can you even read this in Germany if I say "Nazi"?)
If you want to visit, do so. Now's a great time, in fact - you can see our political circus at full tilt. Call Bush an asshole, if you want. Nobody's going to stop you. We call him worse in our newspapers every day. Yours is a great country. But I love mine, and for all the faults of the past 4 years, I'd rather live in mine than yours. (Not the least of which because I don't speak German.)
Re:And why _aren't_ you voting for Bush? (Score:5, Insightful)
Have you seen the price of oil recently?
Re:Fear of powers (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Abuse of Power (Score:3, Insightful)
Agreed; I even found the fact that they used "Homeland" which sounds so much like "Fatherland" to be mildly entertaining.
But they took it from a long US playbook, which includes the late Senator Thomas J. Dodd (D-CT) checking the 1938 Nazi gun control laws out of the Library of Congress immediately prior to writing the US's 1968 gun control laws--which look surprisingly [jpfo.org] like [lewrockwell.com] the 1938 version! (In fact, barring translation issues, they're almost word-for-word according to the second link.)
I don't know which bothers me more:
1. That they do these things intentionally;
2. That we allow them to do it without raising holy hell;
3. That we keep voting them into office.
Re:Confusion (Score:3, Insightful)
DHS should be an organization designed to focus on real terror threats, and leave the rest to other separate agencies - yes, communication can be a problem between agencies, but misallocation of resources by an oversized organization is likekly to be an even greater problem
DHS likely will be split up eventually
Ron Bennett
Re:Uh huh (Score:5, Insightful)
I think this is a bit simplistic. The senate had 735 Bills [state.mo.us]last year according to that site, with language such as:
"A producer member shall submit to the authority an application for the tax credit authorized by this section on a form provided by the authority. If the producer member meets all criteria prescribed by this section and is approved by the authority, the authority shall issue a tax credit certificate in the appropriate amount."
Imagine trying to understand 735 documents composed of such language, some of which can be many many pages, or make "small" adjustments to current laws. Some bills, I'm sure, are written and titled to purposely obfuscate their true intentions as well.
My guess is that's why senators and house members have staffs: to read the bills and tell them what they mean. There's not time enough in the day to read and understand fully all those bills.
But...
I certainly agree that each bill should be fully understood before it's voted on, which would mean a LOT more time between introduction and passing, which would mean fewer bills being passed, which is fine with me except in emergency situations (like aid to hurricane victims, etc.).
Democracy is quietly dying because a buch of lazy people will happily pass the "Happy fluffy bunny (you'd be a nasty pinko liberal for not passing this) bill" without actually reading it...
No, democracy is dying because of fundamental flaws in large scale republics and american culture, and lack of interest and education of Americans.
(Disclamer: I'm an American and I dislike both of the major candidates, but I hate Bush more. Remember though, the DMCA was passed under Clinton.)
Re:Abuse of Power (Score:2, Insightful)
Same difference.
It's a case of priorities (Score:5, Insightful)
It's a matter of priorities and if this our current administration's idea of a law enforcement priority, then we need change really, really bad.
Re:And why are you people voting for Bush? (Score:5, Insightful)
Why label yourself then? (Score:1, Insightful)
Strip off the labels people. If you're already thinking for yourself (ie: you said you don't agree with everything Republicans support), then god dammit, take the next step and strip yourself of the damn labels! Tell people you are AMERICAN and be proud of that. Vote based on the issues you support, and leave it at that. The country would be better off if more people stopped playing "who's team am I on" and just cared about the core issues.
Re:Abuse of Power (Score:5, Insightful)
>If we let these powermad tyrants have power
We did. They won a long time ago. Thanks to things like the "culture war," conservative media passing itself off as "fair and balanced," Reaganomics, the marriage of Christian fundies to the GOP, etc. The damage that has been done will take decades to fix, if not generations.
Re:Fear of powers (Score:2, Insightful)
Well, I am not sure how much successful Osama (foxnews followers its Usama) and Saddam in spreading terror - but I definitely think that they have successfully brought their kind of governance into "the once free country".
Re:Fear of powers (Score:5, Insightful)
Because they weren't doing their job. Their job was to determine the validity of the complaint, which they utterly failed to do. Hence, they failed to do their job.
If anything, the infringer was the manufacturer -- not the retailer. They did not go after the manufacturer, they went after a retailer. Again, they failed in their duties.
Re:And why _aren't_ you voting for Bush? (Score:4, Insightful)
How do you know the claim is bogus? Nowhere does it even say what the actual claim was. Are you the judge and jury because some slashdot article gave you inaccurate and incomplete infromation, that you can pronounce a claim bogus? For that matter, how do you know they didn't have a warrant? The article doesn't mention it either way.
Re:ummm (Score:3, Insightful)
By the way, maybe there are 735 bills a year. BUT it should be common sense to have some priorities, and it did seem clear to most people that the PATRIOT act was something bigger as, say, the latest bill "recognizing the accomplishments and loyal service of XYZ" (there's quite a bunch of those, check loc.gov). So it is CLEARLY not required for them to read all 735. But it is also obvious that priorities are important.
But we shouldn't really be arguing too much about this, because even though I like the job Moore is doing, we must recognize that he also knows where to spin facts and exaggerate things to make his overall point.
Re:Fear of powers (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:And why _aren't_ you voting for Bush? (Score:3, Insightful)
Non citizens do not have the right to speedy trial. US citizens do, and that's why I support the US Supreme Court saying the same thing. So no that right has not been taken from you.
"We used to have a right to face our accuser, now we have annomous tips, they dont leave much for us to face"
Hyperbole. Name one case where that has happened. "We used to have the right to be secure in our person, property and effects, now, not so much, as evidenced by this story."
As I and others said in other postings in this story, this was not a Patriot act investigation, it was a Customs act. The article never mentions whether or not a warrant was present, so for us to declare that here rights were taken away is pre speculation. So no, that right has not been taken away from you either.
Next!
Re:Abuse of Power (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Uh huh (Score:2, Insightful)
I think part of the problem is that unrelated laws are being passed in the same bill & they're given media friendly names based on only one part of the bundle. A good thing would be to force the unbundling of unrelated acts. That way it would be easier to summarize the meaning of the bill & harder to hide the bad stuff.
That way a senator/congressman that wanted to vote down the "Give the police the ability to shoot anyone suspected of thinking of doing anything subversive" clause wouldn't be criticised for voting against "providing Hurricane relief to Florida" because the two things happened to be in the same bill.
If the Hurricane relief bill could legally only contain clauses relating directly to disaster relief in Southern USA people would not have to study the bills to make sure there wasn't any "accidental Fascism" contained within. Or alternatively set up a Disater Relief office with a flexible budget that can come to the aid of areas hit by natural disasters as & when required. Some years they'd be grossly under the projected budget; other years they'd be over but you wouldn't have to get a bill passed every time a hurricane hits.
Personally I'd be a lot happier to see a slowing down of legislation if it avoids the erosion of fundamental rights.
Re:It's a case of priorities (Score:5, Insightful)
Yes, we all know that locking your door is pointless. You need to stop the criminals at their source, not after they've walked into your house.
So, you're saying that scanning containers is impossible, but somehow it is possible to find every single terrorist hiding spot?
Re:Fear of powers (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:It's a case of priorities (Score:5, Insightful)
Pal I have to break you the news, but if we dont start figuring out a way to inspect the containers most of the seaports in this country could be blown to kingdom-come. There wont be any products left to buy.
The Terrorist threat has been blown way the fuck out of proportion by the bush administration. We were attacked (and also had several failed attempts) several times before 9/11. 9/11 was the most succesful for sure, but what exactly made it seem like all of a sudden the terrorists got more well organized, or more well financed than they were before 9/11 ? Need I also remind everyone that we were aware that 9/11 was being planned ? The intelligence was there. The government however is to bloated and bureaucratic to handle things like this, and hence dropped the ball.
Want to be secure ? Leave everyone else the fuck alone. You dont see every country in the world being attacked by militant islamic extremist foreigners now do you ? Its because most countries mind their own fucking business.
Oh
"What you need to do is to stop terrorists at their source not after they've gotten their goods into the harbours."
You think searching the harbours or container ships is a problem ? Take a look at a fucking map, searching and securing the entire globe would be a bit harder. I think you can wait an extra month for your digital camera. The economy will adjust if it has to.
Ok, severe problem with your logic (Score:2, Insightful)
See the DHS is just another governmental orignization, with many branches and duities. One of their braches is now U.S. Customs (customs.gov if you want info on them). Customs used to be a part of the treasury, but since their work is more relivant ot the new DHS, they were moved over. Well guess what? This is one of the things they do, they check out illegal imports. Now they were wrong in this case, which happens unfortunately, but that's their job. They actually aren't the terrorist finders, not their job, not what they are good at.
I know it's popular to jerk the knee and cry about the terrorists whenever law enforcement makes a mistake but remember: You are no better than the politicans trying to use it as a scare tactic when you do. It's just as bad to try and use terrorism as some sort of cut out that makes everything else ok and something to be overlooked as it is to use it as this fersome spectre to erode civil rights.
When I purchaed an amplifier from a private citizen in Canada the DHS, specifically their customs branch, opend the box up, had a good look at it, and packed it back up and sent it on to me. This is not them wasting time instead of finding terrorists, they aren't that group. This is the import package checkers doing their job. I am not going to demand they run to the Middle East and look for terrorists any more than I'm going to demand the cop directing traffic run off and try to solve a murder case.
Re:Mod Parent Up (Score:2, Insightful)
Ever hear of Volitaire?
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."
Despite what you may think, we have (or should I say had) a freedom of speech in this country. Get a clue you moron.
Re:But it wasn't imported. (Score:3, Insightful)
No, that's the secret service doing their job (Score:3, Insightful)
You can get a secret service visit by sending a threatening e-mail to basicaly any valid e-mail address at whitehouse.gov. They investigate all of it because guess what? People have not only tried to kill presidents, they have succeded on a few occasions. It's serious bussiness.
Also notice that said blogger is NOT locked up for life, in fact he didn't even get inconvenienced. Right after your little exceprt he goes on to say "as what I said could apparently be misconstrued as a threat to his life. After about ten minutes of talking to me and my family, they quickly came to the conclusion that I was not a threat to national security."
So, what happened? Well the secret service found out about someone who said they wanted the president dead in a very public venue. Ok so tey need to find out is this just some idiot venting, or is this a wacko who might be a real threat? They go, interview the guy, and in ten minutes decide there's no problem and leave.
What is the damn problem? They did this before 9/11 too. At the university where I work we get about 1 visit per year from them because some student made a threat. It doesn't end up in an arrest, just a check on the student to make sure they really are just a stupid college student, and an explination to said student that this is a bad idea.
If you read his blog you notice a lot of inconsistent ranting. He calls them the Sekkrit Service, because I guess it sounds sinister or something and talks about rights violations, yet admits they were nice about it and non threatening.
This is NOT an exmaple of law enforcement being bad or the PATRIOT act being abused (and there are plenty of examples), it's an example of the opposite. Some kid made a stupid post on his website that could be construed as a threat to the president, which is a serious thing. A couple of agents investiagted, determined he was no threat and just blowing off steam, and that is that.
If you want to argue abuses of power, pick a real example. It's not like they aren't out there.
sorry... (Score:5, Insightful)
That "not be able to inspect" the containers jazz is a load, OF COURSE they could if they wanted to, they don't want to. They manage to "inspect" 80 year old ladies and crippled vets in wheelchairs at the airport. They manage to "inspect" a heap of countries over yonder, to the tune of billions of dollars a WEEK using hundreds of thousands of dudes, some of them making in excess of 600$ a day to just tote a rifle. The "war on terrorism" is a complete fraud. It's war to terrorise americans,oh, that's true, that's really true, but it's being waged by the government, and this article proved it in yet again another small way.
You had to watch it grow ever since the 60s to see it,but it's been creeping incrementalism, and a lot of folks have been warning about it for years. The past few years they have hit the nitrous button, that's the only difference. And they show no sign of relenting, or rolling anything back for that matter, just ever onward. And people have been eating it and sucking it up every step of the way. Can't look at a news site anymore without seeing more and more evidence of it. A FAN at a baseball game shot and killed by getting hit in ther eye with a riot paintball pellet? Huh? Random "courtesy" checkpoints? Huh? Cameras all over staring at you? Huh? Even that name "Homeland Security" WHAT WW2 B war movie did they drag that from? What is all this crap BUT big brotherism and state terrorism?
The goons have proven it, the slow boiling frog, most people will just slurp it down, excuse it, make believe they aren't seeing or hearing what they are seeing or hearing, every step of the way.
Re:Fear of powers (Score:5, Insightful)
First, the title says "expired TRADEMARK", the article takes about the DHS enforcing COPYRIGHTS, then lastly it mentions that the PATENT for the rubik's cube is already expired.
So, like... did anyone bother to go over this and at least make sure that the article was at least talking consistantly about the specific IP protection being applied here?
Re:Why label yourself then? (Score:3, Insightful)
"And no, John Kerry in office isn't going to change anything because you still have Republicans in the house and senate."
I didn't want to sound like another annoying liberal slashdotter who spews anti-Bush/republican rhetoric just to be modded up at +1 liberal.
I'd rather people read the post and understand that while I generally side with republicans, I can still disagree with the actions of those who wear the republican label.
I'm not a politician so I don't consider myself wearing the republican label. I don't feel that saying you're a republican or democrat stifles independent (no pun intended) thought.
But thanks for questioning me though. I like to be challenged and back up my viewpoints. It makes them stronger and everyone should be questioned so they can ask themselves if they really believe all this stuff or are just following a bandwagon, as you claimed I was.
Re:Uh huh (Score:3, Insightful)
You are right, if you let in just anything (P.A.T.R.I.O.T.), then garbage will be passes without being read. SO DON'T.
Not that I can imagine the current politicians taking the job of legislator seriously. The DMCA wasn't read by the legislators of the states that passed it, either. It was 2000 pages long (or more). Nobody can read that. Yet we're supposed to know and obey it. RIGHT!
It's becoming increasingly likely that the purpose of the laws is to make EVERYONE a felon. (Can you PROVE that you aren't one. Just because you haven't yet been accused doesn't prove anything.)
Just how much respect do you have for that kind of legislation?
Re:Fear of powers (Score:1, Insightful)
We best respect Massa's Intellectual Property (Score:3, Insightful)
This sort of incident is best understood when you look at America's history. The apple don't fall too far from the tree. America was born on the backs of slaves and indentured servants.
Historically, the power of the state has almost ALWAYS been aligned with the top of the hierarchy. Back in the slave days, the government mainly worked for Master, or "Massa," the slaveowner, the rich plantation owner, or the merchant, or the rich farmer. The government was designed mainly to take care of Massa's property.
These days the corporation is our "Massa." And it don't really matter whether Massa is right or not. You best obey the Massa, or you get a taste of the whip.
And if you can afford to take Massa into court, then YOU must be Massa.
Always, always act first to protect Massa's property, whether it be a runaway slave, an indentured servant on the run, or one who has been stealing food, or a thief in the cornfield, or a shoplifter, or an IP infringer, then, and only then, ask questions, or deal with it in the courts.
Re:Fear of powers (Score:4, Insightful)
It's perceived that Homeland Security's job is to protect the nation from terrorists. That's how the administration billed the agency when it was created. Whether they have additional (or even completely different) duties or not is lost on about 99% of your audience.
In any event, I think the government has too much time on its hands in some respects, and this incident highlights that.
Re:Fear of powers (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Mod Parent Up (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Mod Parent Up (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Fear of powers (Score:5, Insightful)
What we need is a new language! (Score:1, Insightful)
#Define SuspectedTerrorist {
Posesses {
Explosives;
AssaultFirarms;
WMD;
} AND
Meta {
ThreatendGovernment;
ScrewedByUSForeignPolicy;
}
}
//Process Suspected Terrorists
if (SuspectedTerrorist instanceof entity)
{
monitor(entity)
{
if (obtainMonitorPermission(entity))
{
hFederalCourt = DueProcessStartup();
hFederalCourt.process(entity);
} else {
DestroyMonitorData();
return;
}
}
}
Seriously though, the law can't fucking be "interpreted" when you use a language that is explicit (and I don't mean lost of swearing). Stupid politicians. This is why
Re:It's a case of priorities (Score:2, Insightful)
Tell that to Spain, Australia, Russia, Saudi Arabia, Phillipines, Sudan, etc. What rock have you been hiding under? Islamic extremists don't just hate Americans. They hate anything not ruled by Sharia. You really believe that if we announced "hey guys we're going to become an isolationist country" that they'll stop their bullshit? You are so naive. I really doubt the reason the Islamic militants in the Sudan are murdering African Black Muslims and Christians is because they thought they were towing the Bush line.
Re:And why _aren't_ you voting for Bush? (Score:2, Insightful)
No amount of protection from terrorism - not even if it protected us all ad infinitum - is worth one iota of my precious liberty. There is a bigger number of human lives than I can even conceptualize that were given so that I could live in a place where I have the chance to live freely. Nothing is worth voiding the fruits of their sacrifices. Nothing.
Now on to my point. The only rebuttal I have seen to complaints about the PATRIOT Act have been of the "Don't worry. Nobody will use it to do that sort of stuff."
I humbly submit this:
Even if you think Bush and the executive branch of the government under him are from the highest chorus of angels and would never do anything to hurt the citizens of the USA, it should not affect your judgement of the PATRIOT Act at all. For that matter, it should not affect your judgement of any law passed while he is in office, regardless of who passes it, who proposes it, and who votes on it. A bad law passed by a group of angels is still a bad law.
Say the president is an angel and asks the Congress (who are also a group of angels) to pass a law that provides ways of foregoing due process. Say also that the president, the leadership of Homeland Security and every law enforcement agent in the country are angels and the law is never abused even once. It is still a bad law.
It is a bad law because in the hands of a devil the law could be abused and used to hurt the people of the USA. Your rebuttal - the claim that the law is okay since it will never be abused - is entirely based on the assumption that we will have angels in public office for as long as the law is a law. If you think the terrorist threat is going to be around for a while, then you should expect the PATRIOT Act and things like it to be around for just as long. It shows no signs of going away, and a PATRIOT Act II was even proposed, I believe.
The assumption that this country will elect angel after angel is a tenuous one at best. The President is not the only one you should be worried about. What about the leadership of law enforcement and the DHS? Do you think every one of them is an angel? Have you met all of them? The "goodness" of a law should never have to be judged based on who uses it. This is something that a citizen of this country should agree on regardless of their political affiliation.
A law is a good law if 1.) it does what it sets out to do efficiently, 2.) what is sets out to do is in the public's best interest, and 3.) it can not be abused by those who would abuse it. For the PATRIOT Act, point 1 can be argued on both sides, most people will agree on point 2, but it fails miserably on point 3. I don't know who thought it was a good idea to give law enforcement a way to forego due process, but it's in the Act.
As a citizen, I will not bet the well-being of my country ride on whether or not the people in office have good intentions. I know a lot of people who don't like to see the PATRIOT Act being attacked feel that it is a personal attack on their Candidate of Choice. I mean to suggest that even if John Kerry or Clinton had pushed the PATRIOT Act through Congress, the very same people would be complaining. I definitely would. They would be complaining not because they are Republicans or Democrats, but because they are good citizens. One prerequisite to having good laws is being critial of them.
All that being said, I think it's really funny that a lot of conservatives rag on John Kerry and the liberals in Congress for voting to pass such a heinous law. Who proposed the law in the first place?
Re:Mod Parent Up (Score:3, Insightful)
1. Yelling "fire" in a crowded theater.
2. Threatening to kill the President.
Another is joking about bombs while you're waiting to get aboard an airplane. These forms of speech are not protected. Anyone who does them is stupid.
are trademark cases normally like this (Score:3, Insightful)
About 70 years ago... (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:Mod Parent Up (Score:3, Insightful)
I can attest to this - I was in the Raleigh/Durham (NC) Airport this past weekend and saw a sign while waiting in line for security. It stated that making jokes about bombs or other security threats was not permitted and would lead to interrogation. Fun times, eh?
Re:Fear of powers (Score:4, Insightful)
This is the same thing as arresting a person, then going through due process. You don't wait to have a trial before arresting somebody in a shooting. You arrest the person, arrange bond (to secure the person's appearance at trial) then go through the trial process.
History may repeat itself ... again (Score:2, Insightful)
Power corrupts, to say the least.
Same acts, different people, different time, but will it be same result? If so, who can save us? China? yea sure! Europe... don't think so
--
Cook
but not kitchen!
Re:Abuse of Power (Score:2, Insightful)
http://www.alternet.org/election04/20312/
Re:It's a case of priorities (Score:2, Insightful)
That's why we actually need a government that approaches foreign policy in a proactive way. We need a government that believes in 'soft power' -- that is, winning the hearts and minds of the world around us by doing something that merits it -- not a government that believes we should intervene with hard military power whenever the hell we decide to, fuck things up, and leave without a permanent solution. That kind of thing only creates more antagonism against us. Working through institutions such as the UN and NATO -- even if you don't believe things end up working any differently -- is important because that's the only way we'll change sentiments towards our country. We need to be respectful, we need to be a team player -- not someone who ignores the rest of the world, the real problem, until our backyard gets bombed.
Re:sorry... (Score:4, Insightful)
Blessed are the days when the bad and nasty foreign manufacturers had an import quota of 6000 cars per class per year per manufacturer.
Blessed are the days when steel had an import duty of 30+%
Blessed are the days when... We can continue...
One minor problem though, the day these days return there will be the same measures everywhere else around the globe so no effing container is going out anywhere. Example - the recent spat over steel tariffs between US and EU.
So get real.
Re:Fear of powers (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Fear of powers (Score:4, Insightful)
Cached Copy of the toystore page showing the item. [216.239.41.104] That doesn't look to me as though it's infringing anything I associate with the Rubik's Cube, other than the now unprotected puzzle itself.
My own personal impression, based on the story and the press release you cited, is that the trademark holder is seeking to use the law to harass others for the purpose of stifling competition in the marketing of an item no longer covered by an expired patent.
It would be interesting to know what the basis for the complaint was. Knowing that might cause me to change my current personal opinion.
Re:Fear of powers (Score:4, Insightful)
The Yahoo news article is consistent. "Immigration and Customs Enforcement" only claimed that they were protecting a trademark. The manufacturer of the Magic Cube _also_ claims that the patent on the Rubik's cube has expired, which is interesting but not very relevant.
Only the Slashdot article submitter throws in the word "copyright", which is completely wrong and not relevant to the article. It's a bit sad that CowboyNeal didn't catch this before putting the article on Slashdot.
- Erwin
Not Patent! National Security! (Score:4, Insightful)
Now, if kids start using it, they grow smart and intelligent. And intelligent people start to question questionable orders from the government, protest against warfare, lobby towards upbringing that makes smart kids, may listen to reason instead of blindly following propaganda...
This toy is definitely danger to homeland security.
(but such reasons can't be stated clearly so the dept had to think of some other bogus reasons like the patent or such...)
Re:Uh huh (Score:3, Insightful)
Yeah, and how, exactly, are the people expected to be abrest of and follow those laws if the very people who pass them can't read them?
Re:waste of resources (Score:3, Insightful)
Don't let it get to the point where you will have to put dollar bills in your passport if you want to get through customs without a strip search.
Re:Mod Parent Up (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:It's a case of priorities (Score:4, Insightful)
Do you really want to live in a country where everyone have to wear a AK47 and a bulletproof vest if they go outside ?
The first step... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Fear of powers (Score:1, Insightful)
MOD ARTICLE DOWN (Score:1, Insightful)
One may trademark a log or image.
The cube's image is trademarked.
The patent protected how the cube worked.
Re:Uh huh (Score:3, Insightful)
> to read all the bills" etc. I'm sorry but THAT'S YOUR FUCKING JOB. That's why it's called "a reading"
> before the law is passed - YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO READ IT.
I think this is a bit simplistic. The senate had 735 Bills last year according to that site, with language such as:
"A producer member shall submit to the authority an application for the tax credit authorized by this section on a form provided by the authority. If the producer member meets all criteria prescribed by this section and is approved by the authority, the authority shall issue a tax credit certificate in the appropriate amount."
Imagine trying to understand 735 documents composed of such language, some of which can be many many pages, or make "small" adjustments to current laws. Some bills, I'm sure, are written and titled to purposely obfuscate their true intentions as well.
My guess is that's why senators and house members have staffs: to read the bills and tell them what they mean. There's not time enough in the day to read and understand fully all those bills.
And yet for most of us, ignorance of the law is no excuse...
Re:It's a case of priorities (Score:5, Insightful)
You will also notice that a large number of those countries have a significant oppressed class/religion/whatever. Then quite a few are also just as guilty as the US regarding trying to control the world.
You know what you wont see on that list are any nuetral countries that dont have their own internal problems. Every single one of those countries has there own internal issues, was/is a significant ally of the US or is involved in the middle east on there own.
The criteria for that list is bullshit. The bloods and crips would be on that list if they were shooting at mcdonalds instead of each other, that doesnt make them terrorists, it makes them plain old criminals.
Re:Fear of powers (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:It's a case of priorities (Score:3, Insightful)
The sole purpose of the governements existance is to protect its citizens, not the economy, not big business. The PEOPLE.
Re:Mod Parent Up (Score:2, Insightful)
Let's see now: 'Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.'
Do you want to explain where in there, exactly, the government has any right to ban any kind of speech? What part of 'Congress shall make no law abridging the freedom of speech' is so hard to understand?
Re:Fear of powers (Score:3, Insightful)
In this specific case I tend to agree, granted. I'm just taking issue with the general tone of your comment.
Re:It's a case of priorities (Score:3, Insightful)
Dude, have you been living in a hole the last 4 years?
Re:Why label yourself then? (Score:3, Insightful)
So, what has America done lately that you are proud of?
Getting back on topic: (Score:5, Insightful)
This is the most illinformed shit I've seen on Slashdot in a while. A Slashdot while that is, which is not very long. Sometimes people make a little mistake and think say for instance a trademark is covered under the same laws as copyright. Pisses me off, but it's never the end of the world. But this? The End of the World .
Re:It's a case of priorities (Score:5, Insightful)
The Center for Disease Control (the CDC) keeps odds on what you will most likely die from over the span of your life.
Do you know where terrorism ranks? Your more likely to die from lightning than die from a terrorist attack. That's right. Go to the CDC site and see it for yourself.
Your 8 times more likely to die in your own bathtub than die from a terrorist attack. TERRORISM?
You are 18516 times more likely to die in a car wreck than you are in a terrorist attack at the mall you were driving to. TERRORISM?
Do you know how many children in this country die every year because of no healthcare and no food? Do you know how many homeless people there are across the country?
TERRORISM?
You are THOUSANDS of time more likely to get shot, stabbed, hung, hit by car, flambayed, gored, frozen, drown, bludgeoned, and electrocuted during your life than die in a terrorist attack.
The amount of fear-mongering in this country is completely revolting. VOTE FOR BUSH BECAUSE HE PROTECTS US! Bullshit. How about making the roads safer. That would save thousands of lives as the average peron has a 1 in 81 chance of dying in a car wreck during their life.
I've read articles on how parents fear for their childrens safety in this "age of terrorism", while ignoring the fact that their child is thousands of times more likely to die just around their own homes than in a terrorist attack.
TERRORISM? The only real terrorism I know is the fear-gospel being spewed forth by the media.
"One terrorist attack is one too many." You have a 1 in 197 chance of being murdered in your lifetime. Compare this to a 1 in 88000 chance of being killed by the terrorist. I'm a little more concerned about being murdered.
TERRORISM? With 45 million people being uninsured for health, I really don't think that terrorism should be up at the top of the list. You are THOUSANDS of times more like to die from disease over your lifetime than you are to die in a terrorist attack over your lifetime.
No my friends. Terrorism is not the biggest threat to this country. Ignorance is. This country has real domestic problems of its own that DWARFS terrorism on all fronts.
We've spent billions on a war that didn't need to be fought, but we have millions of starving kids in our own backyard. We've spent billions to precision bomb a country that didn't even have clean drinking water, while thousands die every year in our country because they can't afford health care. Billions have been spent on Homeland Security, while homeless shelters have been packed to gills here in our own country.
Think about it.
~X~
That is why Senators have staffs (Score:3, Insightful)
No, as a senator, you ARE supposed to read it, and/or have hired trusted competent staff to read it and raise any issues. There is NO EXCUSE for a senator to say "we don't have enough time to read all the bills" -- yes, the workload is high, but that is what you ran and were elected to do, and you should at least take responsibility for your vote.
Moreover, that kind of stilted language is not an obstacle to them, as they are almost all lawyers; they are simply writing legally effective language in a way to which they are accustomed (as software engineers write code or specs).
We at least agree that more understanding and slower legislation would be better, and that the electorate's lack of intrest and education is a root cause of our dying democracy.
WTF? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Fear of powers (Score:3, Insightful)
Ah, you must be from outside the United States. It's easy to misunderstand US law with respect to burden of proof, since TV and movies that we export so often make it seem as if the burden is on the accused. It's not.
This should have happened this way:
* Complained filed with H.S.
* H.S. refers it to either FBI or the state's A.G.
* FBI or A.G. issues a warning or:
* FBI or A.G. takes retailer to court or:
* FBI or A.G. refers the matter to the owner of the trademark as a civil matter.
There's no excuse for the way this played out.
Re:It's a case of priorities (Score:1, Insightful)
Puny 22 mm toy gun?
I think you must have meant ".22 cal". A 22 mm diameter projectile (approx .87 caliber) is no toy ... only about 1/3rd inch wider than typical aerial-platform-fired cannon. :-)
If that's a toy, gimme.
Re:Fear of powers (Score:5, Insightful)
This is exactly what you get when you trade freedom and liberty for the illusion of security. Security is always a future risk issue, and only a fool thinks the future is can be controlled by people. Of course there are general precautions, but history has shown that the most effective methods are simply to treat your neighbor as yourself, then only the profoundly selfish, sadistic and crazed are at issue. In which case, you're sunk anyway.
For example, why not empower the State to do daily inspections of every single home to root out 'terrorist cells'? Of course, if this were to be undertaken some "cells" would be found, but the proven reliable sociological effect would yield only the sadistic domination by the very 'security' people responsible for the enforcing the policy. And from the evidence I've seen this behavior cannot be predicted by any level of psychological screening. It's a matter of flawed human nature. And the effect is seen in less than a week, so for all those who think this is slow and unusual and is easily managed, you're simply wrong -- the effect propagates through all echelons of such organizations and is quite thorough and complete.
For those of you following along with the true issues involved, liberty has been redefined by Presidential decree three times in the last 50 years (see EO13083, et al). Of course, the US consitution itself hasn't been changed, but the dictionary used to decode it sure has.
Re:Fear of powers (Score:3, Insightful)
I'll be the first to say that discrimination lawsuits often go to far, but the reality is that many more are quickly dismissed as groundless. The problem is the media loves to report "Corp X is being sued for ejecting a black woman", but doesn't bother to mention that "the suit against Corp X is being dismissed because the woman was ejected for causing a disturbance, and Corp X even has a black female board member."
Learn to see through the hype, and check out the reality. There are cases where someone wins over a dumb claim like this, but it's usually overturned on appeal.
Re:It's a case of priorities (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Absolutely the worst writeup I've seen too (Score:2, Insightful)
What business do these brown-shirts have in such affairs anyway?
The fact that Intellectual Property Law (or, ownership of ideas) is being "Defended" by the UberPatriots is the fucking point.
Because, not surrendering to the might of the Capitalist Oligarchy is Unpatriotic, No? Didnt you hear? Whats Good for GM is good for USofAmerica. Do you disagree? Filthy Terrorist!
Re:It's a case of priorities (Score:2, Insightful)
I think you aren't taking the whole terrorism thing seriously enough.
For example:
- What you call car 'wrecks' I call accidents. Nobody really wanted to get hurt. No one really wanted to hurt anyone else. It's just the way things go.
- Children getting killed around their homes. It's probably just because natural selection is supposed to take care of them. It makes the US stronger as a nation by eliminating the weakest.
- Murder. Hah. It's probably all deserved in the first place. After all, how often do people get unjustly killed? Probably just brought it on themselves.
- No healthcare and food? Oh come on, why don't they just eat at McD's? It's not so expensive! With the amount of added chemicals in the food, you don't need any supplementary medication!
- Bathtubs. Look, if you're wasting all that water taking baths, you are doing the world as a whole a favor by saving water in the future.
- 'Media fear-gospel'? Come on, look, CNN is just trying to keep us all aware of the truly important, fundamentally preventable issues.
I also don't see the problem with ignorance. I mean, if people get too smart, it means they can do illegal things. They might not want to follow the laws that keep us all safe. The system could get broken! I also don't see what you have against DWARFS in this country. I say we leave them out of it.Ok, so everything I've said so far is satirical. Truth is, I completely agree with you. Big surprise.
What I found funniest in the article was the closing line: Can't the Department of Home Security find any 'real' terrorists? How many CNN reports have there been about catching domestic terrorists? Preventing terrorist attacks? Complex plots from foreigners to destroy the american way of life? I think the Dept' probably does more to anger and outrage foreigners than to improve the safety of the USA.
Re:Realities on Slashdot (Score:3, Insightful)
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Re:Absolutely the worst writeup I've seen too (Score:4, Insightful)
Wrong, copyright covers more than text. Copyright covers any fixed expression in a tangible medium. Thus, it covers text, but it also covers sculptures, bike racks, scribbles on paper, computer code on disk, and potentially, Rubix cube designs.
If the mods/editors need a quick refresher on what trademark/patent/copyright/trade secret really is, they can check out my blog. [smiglaw.com] So many people mess this up, I have to keep pointing this out. I'll gladly volunteer to review submissions concerning IP- I'm an IP attorney, and it really bugs me that people use these terms interchangeably.
*sighs louder*
Re:end of the world (Score:1, Insightful)
Anyone who chooses a terror campaign over a state for his people is not a moderate.