Is Comcast Intercepting Packets? 403
nihilist_1137 writes: "According this page, comcast is intercepting your packets to gain knowledge of your whereabouts and then reselling it to marketers." According to the linked message, "This allows them to not only log all http requests, but to also log the response. Maybe they want to profile their customer browsing history for
subsidiaries or resale to marketers. Maybe they want to do their part in
The War on Freedom. Maybe they just want passwords to porn sites. Apparently they aren't using it to maximize bandwidth, because it's not configured to serve cached data."
Isn't this just a normal Transparent Proxy??? (Score:5, Informative)
Much easier to setup on the client side and you catch people who leave out the proxy information.
The fact that the server has other capabilities doesn't mean that they are actually using this stuff. If someone can show me a link to the page where I can buy the marketing data, *then* i will believe you.
This is just speculation.
Comment removed (Score:4, Informative)
This is not a story... (Score:5, Informative)
Many ISPs do transparent caching. Transparent caching at ISPs is more than acceptable. It's not acceptable when major backbones do it, as has happened in the past.
The fact that they can log what you do is just a side effect. The same can be done WITHOUT transparent caching. The 'author' says they added hardware just for this. Well of course they did! They're just trying to speed up access without needing as big of a link needed without using transparent caching.
And at any rate, I'm surprised this got posted. It's just some guy posting to two mailing lists, which got denied at that!
Ultimately though, I feel ISPs should provide a means to remove you from having your link transparently cached. If they do that, then you can't blame them for trying to save bandwidth. The results of a transparent cache can be substantial!
New service packages (Score:4, Informative)
I'm glad sprint just hooked up DSL in my area, I'm switching providers.
According to insiders at Comcast there will be three tiers of service. The current service will be called Silver and it will be 1500/128 for $49.95 plus modem rental. Yes that is true, they are planning on a $10 price increase within the next year after the transition is complete and the merger with AT&T Broadband Internet is finalized. Comcast doesn't want to mess with the rates right now until they get regulatory approval for the merger. But the S.O.P. at AT&T and Comcast is a price increase after a merger. Look at what Cable rates did after the Mediaone transition.
Gold service will be 1500/300 and will allow VPN access and something they are calling priority traffic. This is the old Pro service. The cost will be $99.95. If you are a gamer used to the old MediaOne performance, this Gold level should get you back close to the perf you had with the old system. And yes that means you will be paying double for the same service you had last year.
The new low price option is Bronze. Expected to be 128/64 or maybe 256/128 it should be priced at $29.95. This is the one that is most in the air. I haven't seen a bronze config file yet to see what they are planning.
Modem rentals will be $5 and may increase to $7.
Evidence, please? (Score:5, Informative)
This allows them to monitor and change (or insert ads into) what you read.
Posh. Fear-mongering. Come back with some evidence -- and I'll be as against it as the next guy. And if they are actually inserting ads, then they'll probably be in court with CNN, Disney, etc, so forth, for modifying and distributing copyrighted material.
Interestingly, regardless of what IP you address the packet to, the Inktomi Traffic-Server reads the Host: field to determine where to send the packet. I sent several packets from my home machine to one of my office machines, inside the packet was "Host: www.comcast.net". Comcast illegally intercepted, misinterpreted and altered this packet, and sent it to www.comcast.com. So, you might say there's a bug in this evil Inktomi Traffic-Server thing.
Oh, shut up. That's how a transparent proxy works. I suppose the Linux facilities for transparent proxing -- available for years now -- are also evil?
Where's my clue-by-four...
Re:This has to be illegal (Score:4, Informative)
Re:It's pretty much a done deal (Score:1, Informative)
~~~
Re:This has to be illegal (Score:5, Informative)
COLLECTION, USE AND DISCLOSURE OF INFORMATION ON
SUBSCRIBER USE
Collection of Information: Comcast collects, uses and releases information on Customer use of the Service as necessary to render the Service, to otherwise undertake legitimate business activities related to the Service and to comply with law. Comcast may collect information in accordance with applicable law concerning Customer's use of the Service and customer preferences which are reflected in the choices that a customer makes among the range of services offered as part of the Service, the time that the customer actually uses the Service, the menus and features used most often by the Customer, and other information about a customer's "electronic browsing."
Use of Information: Collecting information contained in transmissions made by Customer through the Service directed at Comcast, its Underlying Providers, Internet web sites, or other service providers to which access is provided as part of the Service, is necessary to provide the Service. Comcast's detailed business records generally are used to help make sure customers are properly billed; to send customers pertinent information about the Service; and for accounting purposes. Customer information is also used to execute requests and orders placed by customers with advertisers, merchants, and other service providers; to understand customers' reactions to various features of the Service or the Internet; and to personalize the Service based on the interests of customers. Such information helps Comcast improve the Service and uncover unauthorized access to the Service or Customer data and may be provided to law enforcement agencies in the event of such unauthorized access.
Confidentiality of Information: Comcast considers the personally identifiable Customer information that is collected to be confidential. Comcast will disclose to third parties personally identifiable information that Comcast maintains related to customers only when it is necessary to deliver the Service to customers or carry out related business activities, in the ordinary course of business, for ordinary business purposes, and at a frequency dictated by Comcast's particular business need, or pursuant to a court order or order of any regulatory body having jurisdiction over matters which are the subject of this Agreement. Additional information regarding disclosure of personally identifiable information is described in the Privacy Statement which can be accessed through the Comcast High-Speed Internet Service home page.
Alledgely Comcast Also Using Spyware (Score:4, Informative)
So now they can track you from your own (Windows) machine, and also through their transparent proxy.
Re:Tangent (Score:2, Informative)
Because Hollyweird is out of date. That used to be true in the days of mechanical switches, but now...pfft.
Well, that, and it provides a lazy director three minutes worth of free suspense.
I recently saw the modern version of this old chestnut on Fox's 24, where the Good Guys (a powerful and secretive yet benevolent government organization, hm) were unable to track down the exact physical location of a cell phone before the desperate-to-found caller was cut off.
I work for a phone company (Score:5, Informative)
I work for a phone company.
No, we sure as hell DON'T have a database. (atleast in Canada). There are only 3 times we keep track.
1. As per customer request (traffic studies, getting prank calls)
2. As per warrant (court order required!)
3. For long distance billing. (we need to know how much to charge you)
local calls are not recorded - we have to add an option in your line programming for that - after meeting one of the above requirements.
Re:Tangent (Score:2, Informative)
In the past, it used to be that someone had to go actually TRACE the path of the physical switches as they connected the outgoing trunk to the local line. Someone actually had to do this manually physically, which is probably the 3 minute thing, but thats ancient tech. Only backwards places like North Dakota uses that.
Re:Tangent (Score:2, Informative)
I recently read an interview with 24's creators. When asked how much law enforcement and intelligence agencies cooperated in the writing of the show, they said something like "We've got a great relationship with the government. We pay our taxes and they leave us alone." So don't expect enormous amounts of realism from that show (eg, people running around shouting classified info over cell and cordless phones.)
Re:Tangent (Score:2, Informative)
Re:I use Comcast, and... (Score:5, Informative)
They've always been able to intercept your passwords, assuming they're over plain HTTP basic authentication, or some other insecure protocol (POP, FTP, etc).
And no, they can't compromise VPN traffic or SSL-protected traffic. Those are encrypted end-to-end. It's the same thing with S/MIME or PGP email. If you use a VPN, or HTTPS, or IPSEC, then you are safe from eavesdroppers anywhere on the net, including your ISP, or whatever evil proxies they have set up to trap your packets.
If you don't trust your ISP to be responsible with your unencrypted traffic, though, you should think about switching ISPs. And if your passwords are that important, then you shouldn't be sending them over insecure protocols.
Re:Tangent actually explained. (Score:2, Informative)
It's still in practice but now it's seconds not minutes that it takes to trace a call that's trying not to be traced.
Re:I work for a phone company (Score:1, Informative)
But gone are the days of the pin register to log local calls (which is what was used pre digital switching). Bits are cheap compared to then, and the biggest reason why they log it all is for the "you never know and since it requires very little to do it, they do it by default"
Experienced Inktomi Admin (Score:4, Informative)
That previous life was working with a large Regional Bell company... the mere mention of selling of consumer info (even just anonymized web logs) caused the blood to run out of their faces. I don't think it'll happen there, but I don't make promises for anyone else. It's quite the panacea of information, even if just used internally.
BTW, Novell's proxy cache is actually faster, easier and quite a bit cheaper. Squid, while free, will likely never reach the same performance levels.
Non-transparent proxies are coming (Score:2, Informative)
Personally I approve of this because it will allow for a more efficient operation of many useful web services like content filtering, virus checking and ad stripping. An important part of this work will also be define a standard way for conforming OPES software to only invoke edge services after authorization from end-users and/or content providers.
Looks like a job for Orangatango (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Tangent actually explained. (Score:3, Informative)
Re:I work for a phone company (Score:5, Informative)
Mostly because of one reason, Inter-State Inter-Lata rules and other smaller FCC phone line fair use rules. Qwest, Sprint, MCI and thousands of other businesses and sometimes counties own the phone lines and the switches. If I make a call, EVEN Out of country, and Go from Qwest owned phone lines to your Canada owned phone lines, Qwest and the Canadian owned company have to reach a agreement on what to charge for the usage, BY THE SECOND.
Third party companies house these charges. The company Qwest uses is called Telview, found at http://www.telveiw.com; it's called a TARIFF library, Telview makes their money by handling these charges and selling them to telecoms. EVERY digital switch in the world uses some system like this, or in conjunction with.
Now the database in play comes in not to track who you are calling so much. But because once your voice packet leaves Qwest lines it is not their propriety anymore and someone has to pay for the usage. Thus MCI can say you as a Qwest user, used X amount of trunk access on their lines, and charge Qwest X amount of dollars for those seconds. Qwest logs roughly about 140+ million phone calls a day, their system is considered by the FCC to be the definitively correct system, In audit type disputes The FCC will even use Qwest records as a third party advisor, because we track EVERYTHING, even all of the other telecoms, and almost all in the world. We just made it into Europe last summer. Anyway these millions and millions of minutes are charged at as low as -5 cent a minute to crazy 15+ cents a minute. It goes negative because of anti-monopoly issues regarding start up telecoms. Seconds are rounded and tracked to the nearest thousandth. On Qwest's system, an audit system HAS to be in place, this is part of FCC regulation crap, not to mention allows the FCC to more or less do their job. Generally that database doesn't have names in it. But the billing database that does have all your names in it if you subscriber to Qwest, private or not.... is a simple sql call away, it quite latterly lives in the same server farm... No stored procedures can link the two databases by LAW. Unless a search warrant is in place. Then with the officer there, we can link them. But the link has to be deleted also under the officer's super vision. Your records are tracked as up to two years, then deleted off, one month at a time. So two years ago to last month, we have no clue of whom you called, and are really glad to have a little more space.
The rule is if you can't use a blue box on your phone line, then you are traceable down to that specific phone. Digital Switch = Trackable.
p.s. For those who wonder, The system is Called NTU, Network Transaction Usage. We use Perl to gather data off the switches, not every switch is alike, including the os they run and the data needs to be parsed for the database. A HP/UX demon is used to process rules, and sort out how they should be poked into the database. While an oracle database floating on 36 partitions in a huge raid system is used to house the data while it lives. The machine NEVER goes down, even it does go down, monitor machines can quite literally mirror the drives and swap out so no data is ever lost. The coolest thing I've ever seen was my cowboy boss walk over to this multi-billion dollar a year machine and say, "Time to test the emergency backup units." These machines are located in other states altogether btw. Then he just pulls the power cord out of this rack mounted 8 by 8.
Transparent Proxies (Score:3, Informative)
- we have all kinds of quality problems. There's a shitload of web apps out there that break with transparent caches, one way or the other, and often in subtile ways. There's even an RFC [faqs.org] about some of them.
- when metering traffic independently of the cache statistics we found that we actually did not save any bandwidth worth mentioning. The statistics for the caches of course say different, but interface counters don't lie
:-)
- customer satisfaction goes down the drain. The reason is, even if there is no problem with the caches, people blame any problem with internet and web site availability on the caches - and thus on us.
But, no, we have nothing in place to collect and evaluate logs. It's just much too much data right now to handle or even store it professionally. OTOH, given technological advances, this kind of storage and evalutaion probably will be trivial a few years from now. So the tendency is definitely dangerous.f.
Re:Shining some more light on this (Score:3, Informative)