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Illinois Raids Welfare for Videogame Legislation

Posted by Zonk on Tue May 29, 2007 11:34 AM
from the glad-they're-prioritizing dept.
Censorship Government The Almighty Buck Entertainment Games Politics
jcgam69 writes "Recent hearings revealed that the State of Illinois spent $1 million defending their unconstitutional video games legislation. The story gets even worse when you learn where the money came from. 'Some of the areas money was taken from included the public health department, the state's welfare agency and even the economic development department. A state representative who attended recent hearings on the issue said that Gov. Blagojevich's staff simply spread the legal bills around by sticking them to agencies which had funds left in their budgets--even if the agencies had nothing to do with the issue or the litigation.'"
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  • Obligatory (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 29 2007, @11:38AM (#19310529)
    Elwood: Illinois Nazis.
    Jake: I hate Illinois Nazis.

  • This really isn't a surprise. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by PixieDust (971386) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @11:39AM (#19310539)
    And anyone who is surprised by this hasn't been paying attention tot he level of corruption at higher levels. This government is rotting from the inside out. One look at the myriad of scandals and corruption at the top is all that's needed to deduce that at lower levels, it's going to be just as bad, albeit potentially not as well known, because it's not as sensational. Doesn't make for news quite as good as a Lawyer testifying before congress that she doesn't want to incriminate herself with her testimony over attorney's being fired. Apparently she didn't understand what being granted Immunity meant.

    C'mon, with idiocy like that rampant, is anyone really shocked by this?

    On the other hand, I can see exactly why this was done, and why it might be ok. It is the taxpayer's money, and it's expectd to be used. They spent it very poorly yes, but it's there to be spent. If the public is upset about it, they need to make that known, by tossing those dips out of office. If they don't do that, then no bitching from you. Either change it or stfu.

    • Re:This really isn't a surprise. (Score:5, Insightful)

      by ravenshrike (808508) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @11:52AM (#19310751)
      Really the headline should read: Just another day of corruption in Illinois politics, move along.

    • Re:This really isn't a surprise. (Score:5, Interesting)

      by XxtraLarGe (551297) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @11:55AM (#19310791) Journal

      On the other hand, I can see exactly why this was done, and why it might be ok. It is the taxpayer's money, and it's expectd to be used. They spent it very poorly yes, but it's there to be spent. If the public is upset about it, they need to make that known, by tossing those dips out of office. If they don't do that, then no bitching from you. Either change it or stfu.
      You're right, it isn't a surprise. In another story about how Municipal Wi-Fi is failing, I posted "Harry Browne said it best... Government Doesn't Work!" and I got modded -1 off-topic. This is another example of government not working. There are tens of thousands of instances of government not working that are in the news every year, doesn't matter if it's democrats or republicans in charge. Then the people go to the polls, bend over and say "Thank you, sir! May I have another?" We really need to get away from the two-party Big Brother mentality. If you want to save this democracy, vote against the incumbent, and vote for 3rd party candidates whenever possible.

      • Re:This really isn't a surprise. (Score:4, Insightful)

        by edwdig (47888) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @12:18PM (#19311091) Homepage
        There are tens of thousands of instances of government not working that are in the news every year, doesn't matter if it's democrats or republicans in charge.

        Your comment just prompted the following thought:

        Ever think about how many things they do get right? Remember, something is only news if it's out of the ordinary.

        • Re:This really isn't a surprise. (Score:4, Interesting)

          by XxtraLarGe (551297) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @12:50PM (#19311507) Journal

          Ever think about how many things they do get right? Remember, something is only news if it's out of the ordinary.
          Yes, as a matter of fact, I do. In fact, I know that millions of drivers licenses are renewed successfully each year and billions of pieces of mail are delivered successfully every day, etc.

          Now I have to ask you "Do you think about how many things they do wrong that you never hear about?" I used to be a contractor on a government project for nearly 3 years. Lots of good people doing the work they were supposed to. But there was also A LOT of poor decision making, especially when it came to spending--I'm talking $800 toilet seat type spending. When you'd point out that we could get what they needed for far less, the reply was often "it's not my money". Also, it seemed that many people in the top of the bureaucracy were quite incompetent. It was usually all of the small stuff was o.k., but when bad decisions were made, they were show-stoppers. Of course, most of the stuff they did didn't make the news, but when a whole group of people didn't get the child support checks they were expecting for over a week because somebody forgot to see if our new system was compatible with another agency's system, it did. Now maybe my experience is atypical, but I'd be willing to bet that it is not.

          • Ever think about how many things they do get right? Remember, something is only news if it's out of the ordinary.
            Yes, as a matter of fact, I do. In fact, I know that millions of drivers licenses are renewed successfully each year and billions of pieces of mail are delivered successfully every day, etc.

            Any suitably large organization will make really dumb mistakes. It's not just because it's the government, it's because they are large. Once direct responsibility of a organization cannot be pinned down to one or a few people then you have all sorts of rampant stupidity such as the short sighted of corprate america, the inefficiency of large government, and the almost pure evil of some corporations (Haliburton).

            • You must not live in Illinois where it's easier to grease a palm and get your suspended license reinstated than for the average person to get their license legally renewed at the DMV


              There's only so many DMV facilities for around 12 million people and only so many hours, you're supposed to renew by phone/mail/internet.

              If you want in-person renewels to go faster, you're going to have to pay more money for longer DMV hours, more offices, and more people.

              .

    • I'm tempted to jump over the border, but Michigan and Indiana are nearly as bad. Things are looking very grim when we couple this with the impending property tax hike and the gross receipts tax. I'd like to give a big "Thanks for screwing us over!" to all politicians.

    • It is the taxpayer's money, and it's expectd to be used.

      If it's Temporary Assistance to Needy Families (TANF, or welfare if you will) money, a lot of it comes from federal block grants. I'm not familiar with Illinois TANF policy, but according to my state, Oklahoma: "Federal money is provided by block grant funding in accordance with federal laws and regulations relating to the TANF program. These state and federal funds are used for assistance and administration under the plan."

      IANAL or work in auditi

      • Just to be clear, it was not my intention to drop everyone in Public service into one category. But the truth is that the corruption in our government is very high, and has been for quite some time. It doesn't start with Joe Shmoe carrying messages, or taking your renewal notice for your DL, or even from the aide to a Congressional Member (usually). It's the decision makers. It's the ones that say "Hey, this sounds like a good idea, let's do this."

        As for someone who said they will bitch no matter what *sn

  • Remember, kids... (Score:3, Informative)

    by brian0918 (638904) <brian0918.gmail@com> on Tuesday May 29 2007, @11:41AM (#19310575) Homepage
    Never trust strangers, authorities, or people named Milorad Blagojevich.

  • As long as it's for the children!! (Score:5, Interesting)

    by faloi (738831) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @11:43AM (#19310597)
    This shouldn't come as a big surprise. I expect a lot of government offices/officials snake money from areas that still have some cash to pay for other interests. It's one of the biggest reasons agencies tend to spend all their money...if they have some left over, there's a chance someone will decide they don't really need that budget money and shift it to some other agency.

    • Well, yes and no (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Normally you try to spend all of your budget in a given year so that the "powers that be" don't cut next year's budget because you obviously didn't need all that money. This is the first I've heard where (apparently) they took already-allocated money back to pay for their stupidity. That sucks even more because you can't even count on the money you already have - you never know when the higher-ups will just change their mind and give it to someone else.

  • Halo 3 or food? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by 192939495969798999 (58312) <info.devinmoore@com> on Tuesday May 29 2007, @11:45AM (#19310625) Homepage Journal

    Which would make you want to commit violence more, playing a video game or not getting a welfare check? Their priorities are completely messed up.

    • Re:Halo 3 or food? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Quiet_Desperation (858215) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @12:17PM (#19311079)

      Which would make you want to commit violence more, playing a video game or not getting a welfare check?

      Someone spending a welfare check on a video game.

      • Re:Halo 3 or food? (Score:5, Insightful)

        by ef738 (1005189) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @01:19PM (#19311837)
        Taking money I've earned to encourage others not to work makes me want to commit violence.
        • You don't like Social Security?

          It's a good thing we "pay people not to work". We don't have enough jobs for everyone as it is. The more people in the workforce, the lower wages are.

                • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

                  by Copid (137416)

                  There was a time when those in need would turn to their community for help when extraordinary circumstances arose.
                  So, how well did that work?
        • Ever think about how many things they do get right? Remember, something is only news if it's out of the ordinary.
          Yes, as a matter of fact, I do. In fact, I know that millions of drivers licenses are renewed successfully each year and billions of pieces of mail are delivered successfully every day, etc.

          Although it grates on your sense of fairness, money spent on welfare now will save you on money spent on law enforcement/ incarceration later. One of the principal causes of crime is disparity in wealth. So h

  • Obviously (Score:5, Funny)

    by Rob T Firefly (844560) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @11:46AM (#19310643) Homepage Journal
    They are far too busy thinking of the children to think of the children.

  • Take it from the legislative budget. (Score:4, Insightful)

    by daeg (828071) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @11:48AM (#19310671)
    That bites. The funds should come from the legislative budget, even if they have no funds left. The Legislature would be hard-pressed to pass more bills that could result in massive legal bills if their pay check was directly at risk.

    Either that or create a discretionary fund that is 100% disclosed to voters at voting time, included in clear wording direct in the ballot.
    • The problem is (as an Illinois native) elected officials in Illinois have a history of using their current elected position to campaign for the next one. A good example of this is the Secretary of State - the first thing the guy elected Secretary of State does is plaster "John Doe, Secretary of State" on EVERYTHING in the state. Tollway signs. DMV. Courthouses. Whatever. You can't go into a state building in Illinois without knowing who the secretary of state is.

      And Blagojevich is a just plain corrupt
      • It's not all bad. With any luck, he'll end up just like our last one.

        • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

          by dada21 (163177)
          He did forget that since businesses haven't been paying their fair share of the tax burden they've got tons of money to spend on lobbyists.

          Totally ridiculous assertion. Illinois businesses pay a higher share of total state and local taxes than businesses in the
          neighboring states of Indiana, Kentucky, Missouri, Iowa and Wisconsin:

          Link [google.com] (PDF warning)

          I run a few businesses in Illinois, and Wisconsin is looking MIGHTY good right now if Blag passes any more business tax legislation. With a horrible zoning situa

  • Think of the children! (Score:5, Insightful)

    by kidcharles (908072) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @11:49AM (#19310695)
    Think of the children! No, seriously, think of the children who need government assistance to eat.

    • Re:Think of the children! (Score:5, Insightful)

      by ab0mb88 (541388) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @12:18PM (#19311085)
      I have found it to be universally true that if you have to be reminded to think about the children, the larger issue probably does not have that much to do with the children in the first place.
      • I have found it to be universally true that if you have to be reminded to think about the children, the larger issue probably does not have that much to do with the children in the first place.

        How could you say something like that?! THINK OF THE CHILDREN!
  • If the legislation was important enough to enact, then it's important enough to defend.

    If you thought the legislation exceeded the scope of government, then you think paying to defend it is bad too. No wonder non-binding legislation is catching on, as it makes both sides happy, or... is that unhappy.

    • Re:Where'e the problem? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by gstoddart (321705) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @12:01PM (#19310879) Homepage

      If the legislation was important enough to enact, then it's important enough to defend.

      If you thought the legislation exceeded the scope of government, then you think paying to defend it is bad too.

      The problem is, similar legislation had been thrown out in other states as being unconstitutional. So spending money on a bill you already know is going to get shot down by the courts is just stupid. Using budgets from other departments to pay for it is absurd.

      From TFA:

      Spending this sort of money on important causes is one thing; spending it on video game regulation approaches that have been repeatedly ruled unconstitutional in other states is quite another. The situation might be more understandable were it not for the fact that Illinois could have easily seen this coming, either by paying attention to what other states are encountering or by opening a dialogue with the likes of the ESA. Instead of taking that cautious approach, the Governor decided to press on, and now the taxpayers will bear that burden. The fact that some of the money was pulled from public health and welfare only makes the situation worse.


      They knew their law wouldn't hold up in court. They spent tax payers money to defend a position they couldn't defend. They did some creative accounting to pay for it. You don't find that a little irresponsible?

      Cheers
  • depressing. It shows you how your money, not the governments, yours, gets wasted every day by a bunch of un-accountable megalomaniacs. And its true of both parties.

  • How it really shakes out. (Score:4, Insightful)

    by landimal_adurotune (824425) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @11:54AM (#19310771) Homepage
    The games in question are almost always rated M for mature and most chains require ID to buy them anyway. So Illonois spent $1,000,000 trying to protect 17 year old children from exposed breasts. There is far more titilation (pun intended) to be had in a no-age-limit Maxim/Stuff/etc. magazine than in nearly all of these video games. Heck the kids could just go to the art museum for far more nudity, and read Genesis and Leviticus for rape/murder/genocide/incest.
  • I constantly hear stories about how politicians took money from place A and spent it on place B. I suspect this varies between states, but can someone explain to me how this works? As far as I know, there's no special bank account where money is deposited for each organization: the budget is set by law - so if the law says "$50 goes here and $100 goes here" I don't see how it is possible to take it from any one of those buckets without passing another law that overrides it. Can someone please explain thi
  • I find this incredibly interesting the class warfare going on in Illinois. Video games are an item that falls into the discretionary spending category. You have extra money and you get the new game for your kid. The people who buy these games, at least for the most part, have the money to cover the necessities in life and then some. So in order to protect these reasonably well off people you are going to take money away from the downtrodden and underprivileged? "We need to protect all of these suburban
    • I agree that the amount isn't really a big deal compared to other things the Chicago municipal government has done, and so trivial compared to national government waste that we can't even hear the plink that this particular drop in the bucket made, but...
      At the municipal level, a million bucks is still significant in many local voter's eyes. As far as staying real goes, you could try to make your case in plenty of neighborhoods classed as working poor, and the sort of thing you'
    • Yes, a million bucks isn't necessarily a lot in terms of a government expenditure, but why is that? Perhaps because so many projects are "porked" out, overpriced, and generally using incomprehensible amounts of money that a million simply doesn't seem big bucks in comparison?

      There are a lot of good things that could have been done with a million bucks. More if it wasn't nibbled down in bits and bites before it got to its destination. Just because we're used to larger wasteful expenditure on the behalf of go

      • Million here, million there, and before too long it starts to become real money.

        Exactly, but when you're trying to clean up a pile of dog shit you pick up the nice big hard pieces first instead of scraping the goop with a trowel. Let's start with the real waste and move on from there, shall we?

      • Re:It's a waste, yes. But get real. (Score:4, Informative)

        by $RANDOMLUSER (804576) on Tuesday May 29 2007, @12:18PM (#19311089)
        Actually, the quote is "A billion here, a billion there, pretty soon, you're talking real money", and ironically it's from Everett Dirksen [wikipedia.org], late Republican (back when Republicans could be moderates) Senator from Illinois.

        Blagojevich is the Democratic haircut who was elected after Republican George Ryan [wikipedia.org] self-destructed. For those of you who don't live here, Ryan was convicted on multiple corruption charges and is currently out on bond, pending appeal. Blagojevich recently defeated Judy Baar Topinka [wikipedia.org], a reactionary Republican hack, for a second term.

        Illinois is a strange state. Politics is definetley a contact/blood sport here.
          • I must agree. Topinka was not the neocon-type we've been seeing at the national level -- she had her own problems. Either way, Blagojevech won the election as the lesser of two evils.
      • Once again I say, "it's only a million dollars." How much money will it cost to get the government to change its policies? Probably more than the million you'd gain by doing it. Why not go after the multiple BILLIONS in waste in other areas?

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by gstoddart (321705)

      It's hard to say this is bad. Anti-videogame laws are unconstitutional and generally stupid.

      Welfare payments trap people in poverty and support criminal activity, drug use, single parenthood (a.k.a. growing up without a father), irresponsibility, dependence, and the inability to develop capabilities or skills.

      Wow. Welfare causes all of those things ... so borrowing money from hookers, junkies, lazy bums, and single moms to pay for court costs is OK? And health care, who needs that, right?

      Nice false dille

      • I'm thinking the baby/bathwater metaphor is the wrong one. Perhaps the purse/sow's ear metaphor would be better...

        Welfare and concentrated housing projects combined have done more harm to the poor than good. Ironic that we're only starting to see poverty decline in Chicago once they started tearing down the projects.

        Paying people to sit on their behinds and make babies who become gang banging drug dealers is not a good solution. Forcing people to make something of themselves is sometimes the only way to
        • A huge portion of the tenants moved out to the far south suburbs (Dolton, South Holland, Harvey, etc). The truly depressing news is that both Dolton and South Holland reported record foreclosures this year and over 97% of them were ARMs. They boot them out of the public housing and predatory mortgage companies eat them up. I still don't support the perpetually government teat, but this seriously damaged these towns.
        • Right. Because living on welfare is this fantastic lifestyle that everyone envies. You are right that "Paying people to sit on their behinds and make babies who become gang banging drug dealers is not a good solution". Fortunately, that is not what welfare is. Yeah, some people abuse the system. In some case not having welfare might be beneficial. But the benefits (like, if you actually care about people other than yourself) are still there for a lot of people who need help.

          Yes, isn't it ironic? Abo
          • Woah... Slow down there, skippy.

            I'm all in favor of helping the poor. I donate heavily to charities that fight poverty and volunteered at shelters, etc. What I am not in favor of is handouts. Making people dependent on the state doesn't help them at all. Welfare is not a glamorous lifestyle, but it's comfortable enough that people don't strive for anything more for fear of risking what little they have.

            You can see the same thing in families -- people who pay for their own college educations do much bet
          • It just amazes me to see what heartless assholes we have all become. Chritians only care about abortions and gay marriage. Heaven forbid you actually think about the least among us. That you work to help the poor rather than ignore them.

            There's this commandment about stealing though. Thou shalt not steal. Stealing is taking from a person against his will. Getting the government to steal (tax) for you breaks this commandment.

        • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

          by Maxo-Texas (864189)
          A dilemma is a problem offering two solutions, neither of which is acceptable. The two options are often described as the horns of a dilemma, neither of which is comfortable.

          meanwhile

          A dichotomy is a division into two non-overlapping or mutually exclusive and jointly exhaustive parts. They are often contrasting and spoken of as "opposites". The term comes from dichotomos (divided): dich- ([in] two) temnein (to cut).

          ---

          A false dilemma would be one where an option exists that is not uncomfortable.

          ---

          I think d

          • A false dilemma would be one where an option exists that is not uncomfortable.

            Close.

            A false dilemma is where you set up two bullshit arguments and expect someone to choose between the two as if they're the only options. (ie. "either we skim money from the welfare budget for court costs" or "we pay for people to make babies and become drug dealers", which is what the OP inferred). The dilemma isn't real (no matter how badly I originally spelled the word ;-), but it is presented as such -- therefore, it's

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