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Wired Releases Full Text of AT&T NSA Document
Posted by
Hemos
on Mon May 22, 2006 08:49 AM
from the the-full-monty-of-information dept.
from the the-full-monty-of-information dept.
ifitzgerald writes "This morning, Wired News released the full text of the AT&T NSA wiretap documents that are currently under court seal. From the article: 'AT&T claims information in the file is proprietary and that it would suffer severe harm if it were released.
Based on what we've seen, Wired News disagrees. In addition, we believe the public's right to know the full facts in this case outweighs AT&T's claims to secrecy.
As a result, we are publishing the complete text of a set of documents from the EFF's primary witness in the case, former AT&T employee and whistle-blower Mark Klein -- information obtained by investigative reporter Ryan Singel through an anonymous source close to the litigation. The documents, available on Wired News as of Monday, consist of 30 pages, with an affidavit attributed to Klein, eight pages of AT&T documents marked "proprietary," and several pages of news clippings and other public information related to government-surveillance issues.'"
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Technology: NSA Had Domestic Call Monitoring Before 9/11? 479 comments
MarkusQ writes "Bloomberg is reporting that, according to documents filed in the breach of privacy suit on behalf of Verizon and BellSouth, the NSA asked AT&T to set up its domestic call monitoring site seven months before the Sept. 11, 2001 attacks. Could it be that they were intending to monitor domestic calls (and internet traffic) all along, and the 'Global War on Terror' was just a convenient excuse when they got caught?" From the article: "...an unnamed former employee of the AT&T unit provided them with evidence that the NSA approached the carrier with the proposed plan. Afran said he has seen the worker's log book and independently confirmed the source's participation in the project. He declined to identify the employee."
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Coupled with Gonzales's remarks below... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Coupled with Gonzales's remarks below... (Score:5, Informative)
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Re:Coupled with Gonzales's remarks below... (Score:5, Funny)
Yes, but will a slashdotting?
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Re:Coupled with Gonzales's remarks below... (Score:5, Insightful)
Actually, no. There's such a thing as principles, you know. I don't believe that a case that revolves around possibly unconstituitional state actions should be secret, since that effectively negates democracy.
If you have an executive that can avoid releasing info on governmental programs to the legislature, and can hide or quash cases where the judiciary declare those programs illegal, what oversight is left? You might as well just elect a king.
So, no, it wouldn't.
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Re:Coupled with Gonzales's remarks below... (Score:5)
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You have to stand up to them. (Score:5, Insightful)
If you don't publicly challenge the actions of the people who are trying to oppress you, you will lose by default.
Freedom is not free. Our forefathers were willing to die for it. The least we can do is risk some jail time (don't forget to vote!).
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In the words of Mark Twain (Score:5, Insightful)
So the boys at Wired are only in trouble if enough people believe what Mr. Gonzales has to say.
One of the near truths we've been taught is the power of the government is defined and limited by the Constitution. Oh, it's a consistent theory of course, but only self-consistent. It's a convenient ficiton, not how things actually work.
The power of the government is defind and limited by what the people will go along with. The Constitution is just lists that out. Not even that really -- it's our understanding of what the Constitution says that empowers or limits government. Nonetheless, the Constitution is a powerful check on the government because as malleable a it is, it is nowhere near as vague as the concept of an "electroal mandate".
Which is why we've had such as bumper crop of semantic creativity out of Washington around the definitions of "unlawful combatant", "torture", "war" and "domestic surveillance". One way to change the law and the Constitution is alter the language out from under it.
These are not the sort of men whose wordplay is motivated by the sheer pleasure of it, and it's quality shows it. It's a brutal and ghastly affair, obsessed with the redistribution of power.
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Open for litigation (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Open for litigation (Score:4, Interesting)
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Re:Open for litigation (Score:5, Informative)
And for that, I have incredible respect for their editors, allowing such actions to continue, indeed showing that they are willing to take a stand against the assault on press freedoms that have been a regular marching call of the current administration.
Not that I didn't have a lot of respect for Wired before... but if there is a preemtive legal fund, let me know where to contribute.
I know /. probably isn't the right place to say "Thank You" to Wired, but I'll do it here first, and then email them next.
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Re:Open for litigation (Score:5, Interesting)
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EVERYTHING is "treason". (Score:5, Insightful)
At it's most pure form, "treason" means attempting to destroy the government.
So, going public with details on what may be an illegal operation by the government is in no way "treason". Except to those who would like to claim that any actions they don't approve of would "hurt" the government (translation: "them and their party") and "help" the "enemy".
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Re:Open for litigation (Score:5, Informative)
Most famously, there are the Pentagon Papers [wikipedia.org]. In 1971, the New York Times published excerpts of Department of Defense documents leaked by Daniel Ellsberg. Roughly, the documents showed that the government had lied about the Vietnam War. The US government obtained an injunction against the Times, on national security grounds. The Supreme Court later overturned the injunction, but the decision, as my not-a-lawyer brain understands it, did not make it clear when the press can get away with this sort of thing.
This is not perfectly analogous to the current situation, because it is AT&T's documents that are being leaked, not the government's.
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Thank you Wired.... (Score:5, Interesting)
Patriotism is being loyal and loving your country unconditionally and your politicians when they deserve it.
This administration deserves neither loyalty nor love.
Expecting the conservative mod down in 3..2..1
Re:Thank you Wired.... (Score:4, Interesting)
I'm glad that they released the full text of the "secret" documents. This kind of this should be open for public review in the first place.
All good and loyal citizens should be clamoring for a public review of the actions taken by the N.S.A., and this administration, against it's citizens.
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You would not be "modded down" by a conservative. (Score:5, Insightful)
Conservatives stand for the ideas of the Founding Fathers. They are sickened by any limits on the freedom of expression, especially when it comes to political correctness or legislation that prevents the release of documents as in this case. A true conservative would be happy that you were able to openly present your view on this matter, and they would support you in every way, even if they did disagree with you. A real conservative would likely even be disappointed that there's a moderation system here.
Many of those who pass themselves off as Republicans today are not conservatives at all, even if they claim that they are. At best, they're neo-conservatives, but even then that's a misleading title. What they have done is take the worst of liberalism, and added extreme feelings of nationalism and religion to it. It's the sort of political ideology that resonantes with the less intelligent people of society. That is indeed why the Republicans are popular with rednecks in the US, for instance. They are universally disliked by actual conservatives, however.
So please, don't confuse "Republicans" with "conservatives". They are two very distinct groups of people, with two very different attitues toward basic issues such as freedom of expression, individual liberty, and so forth. Every real conservative is completely mortified by the recent goings-on within the US, and their involvement in wars around the world.
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Re:You would not be "modded down" by a conservativ (Score:5, Insightful)
And yet our founding father executed several people as spies - for publishing military information to our enemies. The situation is not as black and white as you make it out to be. (For example, by having Wired publish this we are having the least informed person make the disclosure decision. Remember, these programs have bi-partisan Congressional oversight - but only by the security committee. The Congressmen that are posturing are just using the fact that they are not on the committe for political gain. Don't be naive, look for the motivations of your representative.)
It's the sort of political ideology that resonantes with the less intelligent people of society.
Ah - no bias here! Honestly, the same could be said about any political party. Half of the people have an IQ less than 100. Very few have a high IQ (above 140 or so). Dumb people out vote you, get over it. (As a collorary to what I said above, your representative is primarily conserned with convincing those that do not check facts, but watch the news. Always check the facts! [BTW, as a republican you should be reading this site for an opposing viewpoint. I'm not sure what you should do as a Democrat - is the Drudge Report any good?])
And I find it laughable that someone (the grandparent) is worried about getting modded down by conservatives. Conservatives? Slashdot?
Watch, this comment will be modded down by liberals - virtually guaranteed!
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Re:You would not be "modded down" by a conservativ (Score:5, Insightful)
You're kidding, right? Slashdot is pretty far right. Look at the discussion any time the question of trade unionism [slashdot.org] comes up. One can hardly call this a left-wing consensus. The number of Thatcherites and Ayn Rand fetishists here is amazing. You'd struggle to find someone on /. seriously favouring the nationalisation of all industry, mass organised labour and a really high (like say 90%) top rate of income tax. THAT would be left-wing.
If there's a political consensus on /., it's a very individualist one. We're hackers, solitary creatures uncomfortable with being interfered with by either governments or corporations. It's right-wing, but also anarchistic, what you might call libertarian.
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Re:You would not be "modded down" by a conservativ (Score:5, Informative)
Viewing political ideologies as left-right is too simplistic. I like the Nolan chart or other spectrum approaches [wikipedia.org] better.
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Re:Thank you Wired.... (Score:5, Insightful)
I disagree, strongly.
To my mind, an American patriot is loyal to the ideals of freedom - freedom for all - as expressed in the Declaration of Independence and Bill of Rights. And surely the highest mark of a true patriot is to THINK FOR THEMSELVES.
There is nothing "unconditional" in true independent thinking.
I consider myself a patriot. And I surely do love the ideals this country was (ostensibly
But what the country is today is FAR from ideal, and I am not refering to the government only. In fact - one could make a solid case (As V did in V for V) that this society has the government it deserves. And what does that say about us?
As for Wired news posting this info, I am sure others have thought this, and maybe some have said it, but it's worth saying again: DOWNLOAD AND ARCHIVE the Wired info! This way it can't be "disappeared" in a "server accident"
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AT&T fear they will suffer severe harm (Score:4, Funny)
These documents should not be protected (Score:5, Informative)
Good job, Wired. (Score:5, Insightful)
If someone doesn't want information about a crime committed out in the open, they shouldn't have let that information out. There is no such thing as blackmail, in my mind, and there is no fair trial if you're guilty and the information is out there that proves it.
The immorality of what the NSA and AT&T have done is worse that the illegality of it. I see no reason why the ultimate penalty should not be paid by the government officials who created this beast. Treason is treason, and violating one's oath to uphold the Constitution is treasonous.
Of course nothing will happen. Some fines? Some words about terrorism? Do people not see that the worst terrorists are those with the worst weapons?
Re:Good job, Wired. (Score:5, Informative)
I never want a judge or a federal official telling me what I can and can't say. Ever. I don't care what people think their right is in a fair trial, but my right to speak my conscience or reveal information about others should be protected from government infringement.
I disagree. You can say whatever you want, but be prepared to face the consequences. Many of the laws restricting speech serve a very necessary purpose. Here are some examples:
There are plenty of other legitimate reasons to limit free speech. I'm less convinced of the need for "trade secrets" and certainly it does not trump revealing political corruption and illegal actions by government officials (the most highly protected form of free speech). In this instance there is little to no justification and the executive branch has absolutely no authority to suppress this speech because of national security concerns.
The immorality of what the NSA and AT&T have done is worse that the illegality of it. I see no reason why the ultimate penalty should not be paid by the government officials who created this beast. Treason is treason, and violating one's oath to uphold the Constitution is treasonous.
I'd argue that what they are doing is illegal and unethical, but not necessarily immoral. But it is the letter of the law that needs to be upheld to insure that we continue to be a nation of law. I would also consider these people to be oathbreakers, violating their oaths to uphold the constitution, but then, so is pretty much every member of congress and every person in the armed forces. The constitution and bill of rights is just a speaking point these days, and is in no way enforced. The federal government is just what the founding fathers tried to prevent. The issue is what to do about it. In this day and age of mass media can an opponent win on the reform platform? I thinks so, but without a lot of money behind them and certainly not from within either mainstream political party.
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Such a blatant attack on freedom. (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Such a blatant attack on freedom. (Score:5, Insightful)
ANY attack on a people's freedoms are equal. Whether it be free speech, privacy, or life. These values should all be held equally; any attack on one should be defended as vehemently as an attack on any other.
I think it's you who needs their scales adjusted.
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Should we trust AT&T with our data? (Score:4, Insightful)
Any company given over 'private' data (whether it is mine or another citizen's) should be held accountable if they are breaking the law.
Or do we really want to live in a paranoid society run by a paternalistic Government?
Wow... If the EFF doesn't get 'em... (Score:5, Funny)
Check out the photos of the "secret doors". Now, I understand that networking can get a bit messy, but that doesn't justify keeping a needlessly unsafe work area. That place looks like a nightmare! And not even remotely handicap-accessible.
For shame, AT&T... Blatantly violating the US constitution we can overlook, but a dangerously messy work environment? Tsk tsk tsk.
Ah well... on the bright side, if they nailed Al Capone for tax evasion, perhaps we plebes will eventually see some form of justice done in this case.
Wired! (Score:5, Interesting)
But seriously, I wonder how long this will stay online. I'd encourage those interested to save a copy, and mirror the crap out of it.
The wheels of justice move slowly (Score:4, Interesting)
Everyone in the world but AT&T and NSA can see the train wreck coming. Time for some timely resignations about now, and please please please can we all drop the bottom out of AT&T stock just now too!
Where is Judge Judy when you need her? I can't wait to see what unimaginable harm this will do to those wanting to take away more and more of my 'rights' as a citizen of the Empire of the Dollar.
No, I'm not posting AC, the American system of laws and justice do have a good balance most of the time, and eventually, if you play with fire long enough, you get burned. I am given the right to discuss, even rant about how my government is serving me. As of today, I still have all of the rights. I would like to see those spying, criminals get the justice they actually deserve.... treason against the people of US.
The right to bear arms is to ensure that the government remains humble, among other things. Despite that fact that this would be a lopsided event, the framers of the constitution did not try to make it impossible for future citizens to remove the government from power. NOW, I'm not saying that we should, for the most part, I like the way the US government works. What I'm unhappy with is that there are entrenched in that government, people who would abuse the power granted to them for their own gain. People who would misuse those power to abuse the rights of citizens for their own gain.
We, the people.... demand to know who those people are, and what they are doing. When the government acts in the dark, hides from the light of oversight, it is time for change... Its a mid-term election year, and 2008 promises to be a special kind of election. So lets all dust off our thinking caps and start taking notes:
Who is making mistakes now?
Who is supporting DRM/*AA/stupid Internet laws?
And so on... then lets all vote accordingly when the time comes, even if it politically seems wrong. A good mix of all three parties, and a few token representatives from the fringe parties is "GOOD FOR AMERICANS" (TM) and thus good for America, America's allies, and the world in general in as much as it affects the world in general.
And, if you're not a US citizen, don't be afraid to share your notes. I'm sure you get different news than we a 'given' here in the US. Lets make it a wiki if we have to
What do you think? Am I off my rocker here?
Looks like proper CALEA Lawful Intercept install (Score:5, Insightful)
While I agree that CALEA is an overly broad statute, it does require network operators to be able to provide the capability for court-ordered lawful intercepts. The whistle-blower, Klein, so far doesn't seem to have produced any evidence that AT&T and the NSA are actively spying without court orders, just that they could. But from that viewpoint, so could any phone company that controls the local loop for Internet or telephone calls.
Klein makes an incorrect intuitive leap when he says that since AT&T Narus system is spliced into their links to Verio, Genuity, UUNet, etc. that means they can read the entire internet. This is wrong, they can only read traffic that has been routed over their network, generally that means only traffic to, or from, one of their customers, as required by CALEA. The major Internet backbone links are OC-192 and higher, the Narus system described in the document could only handle up to OC-48 (1/4 the speed of OC-192 circuits).
On the issue of NSA being involved in this, it is possible that this system wasn't implemented for CALEA, but instead to allow NSA to wiretap conversations that had been discovered to be heading out of the country, and then requested to be intercepted. For instance, if they had an IP address of some mail server in Iraq, they could tell (legally without a warrant) AT&T to give them logs and conversations from any AT&T customer, over any AT&T network link, specifically to that foreign IP address. Or at least that is the way NSA and the administration perceive the rules for foreign intercept.
Another potential reason for NSA cleared individuals having access to the rooms is that NSA performs security clearance screening for telecommunications related lawful intercept employees. Which would be a logical part of the protection of a CALEA lawful intercept operation from being tampered with by foreign agents, or non-authorized parties.
Re:Thanks for respecting the legal process - NOT (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Thanks for respecting the legal process - NOT (Score:5, Insightful)
Now, I am not a lawyer, but Wired News != The EFF. Sure, it might be abusing the legal system but doesn't ATT (and other big corperations) do that all the time?
Sometimes you have to fight fire with fire.
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Re:Thanks for respecting the legal process - NOT (Score:5, Insightful)
Of course I wouldn't like it. I wouldn't like losing, either, but that's how the game is played.
The whole point of a trial is that one group says "X has wronged me", then both parties defend their claims in front of the world and a representative group decides the outcome.
You think that evidence should be kept from public view until after the jury's decision? That sounds an awful lot like a secret trail. What happened to due process and the right to "a speedy, public trial?"
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Re:Thanks for respecting the legal process - NOT (Score:5, Insightful)
This gets to the larger issue. As much as I am concerned about spying on Americans, and the mis-deeds of AT&T, I am much more concerned that the administration's actions in putting itself above the law sets a precedence for gross and blatant violation of the law by many. In short, what we have here is the begining of the breakdown of law and order.
That said, how do you fight those who are above the law when you are constrained to play by the rules? Consider that the administration stopped the Justice department investigation into the NSA [wired.com] by refusing to issue clearances to the Justice Department. Any ideas on how to deal with this when the legal system has been co-opted by those who are committing the mis-deeds? Does legality have any meaning in this case?
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No solutions, only bitter complaining (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Thanks for respecting the legal process - NOT (Score:4, Insightful)
Actually I think you have the question inverted. A closer fit to reality would be:
"Next time you are in court, how would you like evidence against you taken out of the normal public record (which allows the public to track how the government administers justice), before the jury has made their decision?"
And AT&T's apparent answer was "Hot damn! YES!!"
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Wired did the right thing ... for a democracy (Score:5, Insightful)
The court's gag order is very specific in barring only the EFF, its representatives and its technical experts from discussing and disseminating this information. The court explicitly rejected AT&T's motion to include Klein in the gag order and declined AT&T's request to force the EFF to return the documents.
Wired didn't abuse the system, they played right within the rules. This is exactly the sort of case that makes democracies stronger - the government is accused of widespread abuse of power, and tries hard to avoid having any light shed on its case. The press reveals the evidence against the government, and the public gains insight into what their elected leaders are doing. Without an unfettered press, we'd have no clue what they were up to.
Bravo, Wired.
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Re:Hopefully this will get solved in court (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Hopefully this will get solved in court (Score:5, Insightful)
You clearly learned nothing from the American Revolution. Had that revolution failed, every person who signed the Declaration of Independence would have been drawn and quartered as a traitor.
Ever wonder why your signature is referred to as your "John Hancock"? Take a look at a picture of the Declaration of Independence some day. You'll see that by far the largest, most prominent signature is that of John Hancock. This was not him being arrogant - this was him making sure they knew his name. This was an act of courage on his part.
You're replying under the assumption of "The ends never justify the means." Which in almost all cases is true.
The one case where it is NOT true is the attempt to fight for freedom and save our liberties from disappearing. That is what our Founding Fathers did. They were criminals until they successfully won the Revolution.
And so it is now, for people who stand up to our government and say "You cannot trample our rights and liberties. We will stop you." The government considers them criminals (and those who have swallowed the "party" line).
People who care about freedom consider them heroes.
I am in the latter group.
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Re:This might seem amazing but... (Score:5, Insightful)
Oh, I think you're wrong there. While the gag order may have been applied to the EFF, that Wired published this may bring heat down on the magazine and the reporters. I think it is brave for Wired to come forward with this information knowing that ATT and the NSA probably don't want it published.
I don't think it's "men in black vans" risky, but legally risky. You know Wired lawyers signed off, first, right?
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Re:This might seem amazing but... (Score:5, Informative)
-Rick
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Re:This might seem amazing but... (Score:5, Insightful)
Reporters are worried they are already subject to this kind of thing http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/05/15/1
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Re:This might seem amazing but... (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Irresponsible "Journalism" (Score:5, Insightful)
Yes, we are a nation of laws. One of our first, and most important ones says:
"Congress shall make no law...abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press"
The executive branch isn't given the ability to stifle this right simply because some of the facts it exposes might be embarassing or actually illegal. If you really do think this is a nation of laws, you should be complaining about the White House breaking them long before Wired News.
>For those who would try and turn this around to point at the current administration, Let us all keep in mind that everything going on with the NSA is perfectly LEGAL.
And how exactly would you know that? Because the administration says so? For anyone who even pretends to respect freedom, that's not enough.
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But the administration which made those laws. . . (Score:4, Interesting)
It seems to me that Wired has decided not to respect fraudulent law makers, which is what the voice of a conscientious people should be doing. I certainly hope that the people's voice when it contests fascism avoids being crushed into silence. I applaud those who have the guts and nobility to push back against criminals where others are too cowardly or ignorant to stand up.
-FL
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Re:Irresponsible "Journalism" (Score:5, Insightful)
At what point will journalists in this country realize that we are a nation of laws?
This is almost completely untrue. We are not, and never have been, a nation of laws. Laws aren't at the top of the hierarchy, and hopefully never will be. We are a nation of principles, and all our laws are subject to adherence to those principles.
When someone breaks a law in pursuance of those principles, they do our country a service. If they have the courage of their convictions, they may even be able to get the law overturned. If, on the other hand, it is determined that those principles do not support their action, the law will be upheld, and they will be held accountable for violating it.
Wired, from their own words, seems to believe that they're not even breaking the law (violating the court order) in this case. But if they are, they are clearly doing so in an attempt to bring matters to public attention that many of us feel require more public scrutiny.
So, at what point will the administration remember that we are a nation of principles? They seem to have convienently forgotten the ones they don't like.
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Re:Think about this when you read it (Score:5, Informative)
Another
MAE-West is the main interconnect for backbone providers on the west coast. Another key interconnect on the east coast (MAE-East [wikipedia.org]). Klein's document provides solid information that this "secret room" setup was being duplicated at many other AT&T locations, and AT&T is (of course) a member of the MAE-East exchange as well.
So yeah, they are tapping into pretty much all of the US-based internet.
Now, you were saying something about mindlessness?
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Re:Think about this when you read it (Score:5, Informative)
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Re:Sharing numbers with NSA is legal (Score:5, Interesting)
I think that's a little unfair to say that. There is widespread opinion in the legal community that what the NSA is doing is illegal. For example Kate Martin [acsblog.org] of the Center of National Security Studies [cnss.org]. Also don't forget Qwest turned down the government's request because their own internal lawyers thought it was illegal.
We won't know the "offical" legality of the program until SCOTUS makes some sort of decision on it. If that ever happens....
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