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Apple Applies for a Touchscreen Gesture Patent

Posted by ScuttleMonkey on Sat Feb 04, 2006 05:08 PM
from the wild-speculation-for-discussion dept.
Patents Businesses Apple
SuperMog2002 writes "According to an article in PC Magazine, Apple has submitted an application for a patent on "several methods of applying gestures to touch-sensitive input devices." Could there be a new form of tablet PC or PDA in Apple's future?"
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story

Related Stories

[+] Apple: Multitouch Gesture Patents Could Prevent Standardization 210 comments
ozmanjusri brings us a Wired report on Apple's efforts to patent the multitouch gestures used on their laptops, smartphones, and tablets. The article discusses concerns over how this could affect the standardization of certain gestures in developing multitouch technology. We've previously discussed the patent applications themselves. Quoting Wired: "If Apple's patent applications are successful, other manufacturers may have no choice but to implement multitouch gestures of their own. The upshot: You might pinch to zoom on your phone, swirl your finger around to zoom on your notebook, and triple-tap to zoom on the web-browsing remote control in your home theater. That's an outcome many in the industry would like to avoid. Synaptics, a company that by most estimates supplies 65 to 70 percent of the notebook industry with its touchpad technology, is working on its own set of universal touch gestures that it hopes will become a standard. These gestures include scrolling by making a circular motion, moving pictures or documents with a flip of the finger, and zooming in or out by making, yes, a pinching gesture."
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Apple Applies for a Touchscreen Gesture Patent 50 Comments More /

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  • Enough already. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by croddy (659025) on Saturday February 04 2006, @05:13PM (#14643284)
    Argh! Enough already with the "doing foo... with a computer!" and "doing foo... on a mobile device!" patents. You're not impressing anybody.

  • Scratches? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Reaperducer (871695) on Saturday February 04 2006, @05:17PM (#14643296) Homepage
    Has the tablet market come up with a way to deal with screen scratches? I think back to my trusty Palm IIIxe which after a few years suffered from horrible wear in the silk screen writing area. I'd hate to have dull spots on my computer screen where the GUI displays common elements.

    • Re:Scratches? (Score:5, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 04 2006, @05:29PM (#14643332)
      Has the tablet market come up with a way to deal with screen scratches?

      If anyone can figure out a way to prevent unsightly scratches on a portable device screen, I'm sure it will be Apple.
      • Strangely, I'll have to disagree. I'm a mild Apple fanboy, so don't let's get bent out of shape, but it seems they only care about the appearance until it's sold. The Powerbook G4 has a notorious problem with screen scratches because the tolerance between the screen and the keys is so little. And I've had four Powerbook G4's now -- from the original Titanium to the most recent 17", and they all have the same problem. I am careful and take good care of my stuff, but still get these screen scratches. You

    • Re:Scratches? (Score:2, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Has the tablet market come up with a way to deal with screen scratches?

      I don't know where you've been, but the solution has always been to use extraordinarily cheap static-cling screen cover sheets. I don't know how you could have used a Palm for years without knowing about them.
    • Has the tablet market come up with a way to deal with screen scratches?

      Currently, litigation seems to be the solution of choice for screen scratches.

      In related news, attorneys have recently discovered that it is easier to file a law suit than it is to adjust the volume on a music playing device.
    • Has the tablet market come up with a way to deal with screen scratches?

      Well, we could sputter diamond-form carbon coatings on screens, at a cost of only a couple of hundred bucks per unit...

      -jcr
      • Only a couple hundred bucks per unit? Sign me up!

        (said as someone that bought a Newton MP 2100, haha, but eventually also bought much cheaper Palm Pilots and Visors)
        • Only a couple hundred bucks per unit? Sign me up!

          Ok... That's one. Get back to us when you're ready to place a million-unit order.

          -jcr
    • That was solved many many years ago by not using touch senstive 'mats'. Instead you use active 'pointers'.

      Of course if you lose your pointer you are totally screwed, but at least scratches in the surface dont hurt you and you can use much stronger materials. They are also more expensive..

  • Maybe... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Eightyford (893696) on Saturday February 04 2006, @05:21PM (#14643304) Homepage
    Maybe I had it right when I came up with the iPod Touch [ohmfree.com], a while back.
  • Apple did some really great things with the Newton. They were a little too early, though. Competitors like Palm and Casio did them one better in marketing and ubiquity (probably price, too, if I remember). The Newton and eMate are great, but didn't make it.

    Apple waited a bit before coming out with a portable music player (didn't make a CD player, and watched the first few MP3-Type players hit market). In this case, they did a great job of design and marketing. It's been a hit ever since.

    Now, Apple has m

  • YRO? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Distinguished Hero (618385) on Saturday February 04 2006, @05:27PM (#14643326) Homepage
    What exactly does this have to do with my rights online?

    • Re:YRO? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by joe 155 (937621) on Saturday February 04 2006, @05:32PM (#14643344) Journal
      i think its because apple is applying for the patent, this will make it more difficult for developments in the future based around similar technologies just with different makers. The idea, if they can make it work well, will no doubt be a key feature in future devices when the push to make them smaller means less space for buttons etc... Holding back this is bad for the free market, therefore bad for your rights as a consumer
      • I think it's because apple is applying for a patent on something that is pretty obvious to anybody skilled in the art, and has actually been done in about 17 other places. Just check around this story for lots of examples.

        • Re:YRO? (Score:3, Insightful)

          by dr.badass (25287)
          I think it's because apple is applying for a patent on something that is pretty obvious to anybody skilled in the art, and has actually been done in about 17 other places. Just check around this story for lots of examples.

          The only thing there are lots of examples of is people not reading the patent application but thinking they know what it's about anyway.

          Also, what "art" does one have to be skilled in for it to be so "obvious"?

  • More Prior Art (Score:4, Informative)

    by Grey Ninja (739021) <matter.grey@gma[ ]com ['il.' in gap]> on Saturday February 04 2006, @05:29PM (#14643334) Homepage Journal
    B&W, Palm, etc. have already been mentioned as having prior art. Honestly, this is why I hate corporations like that. But I think there's another party [warioware.biz] who also has prior art on such a thing. I mean, these kinds of patents are just stupidly ridiculous.

  • Read the patent before you comment (Score:5, Informative)

    by jeti (105266) on Saturday February 04 2006, @06:11PM (#14643483) Homepage
    As far as I can make out, each claim specifically mentions a multipoint touchscreen. Unlike the touchscreens normally used in PDAs, it can register pressure at several points simultaneously. Furthermore all described gestures need the screen to be touched at several places at once. But since the patent mentions virtual controls, I wouldn't really describe the interaction as a gesture. Gestures typically are not performed on a control.

    Please take that into account when you try to come up with prior art.

  • Wonder if... (Score:5, Funny)

    by musonica (949257) on Saturday February 04 2006, @06:26PM (#14643522) Homepage
    one of the new patents will include "navigating interface via tongue", cause we all know apples aqua UI is sooo good you want to lick it?
    *runs away and hides*

  • Apple is teh evil ... NOT! (Score:4, Insightful)

    by ajwitte (849122) <slashdot@andrewwitte.com> on Saturday February 04 2006, @07:00PM (#14643646) Homepage
    Honestly, I wish people would quit saying "Apple/Microsoft/Google/FooCorp is evil because they applied for patent X", even if the patent is for something really obvious (like this one seems to be) or stupid. Given the current legal climate, companies are forced to obtain patents like these so they can defend themselves against (usually smaller) companies that would otherwise get the patents later on (or dredge up old, semi-related patents) and then bring lawsuits. Save the complaints for companies that actually abuse patents (Eolas comes to mind), and the USPTO and the legal system that allow this **** to continue. Also, to the people who keep pointing out "prior art"... please note that this patent application is for a MULTI-POINT touch interface.
  • Think video iPod with the full front of the device as the screen, and the touch wheel just that. The wheel would only be visible when you were using it, alpha'd over the video being displayed.

  • Also in Windows Vista (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Utopia (149375) on Sunday February 05 2006, @02:43AM (#14644874)
    Vista also has touch screen guestures in the current beta2 builds.
    Funny this article come up today. I have been playing with the touchscreen tablet UI in Vista all day.
  • The Newton had some limited gesture recognition, such as "scratching out" text or graphic to erase it. This was one of the features that made the Newton so incredibly easy and fun to use. IMHO, neither Palm nor Microsoft has been able to top it (I have a PocketPC device and it is proof positive that MS just doesn't get it).

  • multi-point already exists (Score:4, Informative)

    by John Nowak (872479) on Sunday February 05 2006, @01:29PM (#14646516)
    Just to correct some people here, multi-touch pads already exist and work very well:
    http://www.jazzmutant.com/lemur_overview.php [jazzmutant.com]
    • Palms have had this for awhile have they not?

      Maybe Apple can claim they were there first with the Newton. It is more cost effective to wait and see if something catches on before applying for the patent.

    • yeah, but you had to use a pen there! http://www.fingerworks.com/ [fingerworks.com] is probably more like what they were considering, except now there's a screen under it, so you pick up on the icon itself, instead of moving the pointer and then doing a pick up motion! *I haven't read the article*
      • You don't have to use a pen (stylus) with a palm pilot. You could, but you didn't have to. For the gestures you can use fingers, and they are not very exact. For writing you have to be a little more precise, but even a fingernail works well.

    • Re:Palm OS (Score:5, Informative)

      by dr.badass (25287) on Saturday February 04 2006, @06:18PM (#14643496) Homepage
      Palms have had this for awhile have they not? Not handwriting recognition - you could, say, drag the pen from top to bottom and the backlight would come on.

      Palms only recognize one point at a time. The patent covers multi-point gestures, like (as described), zooming in on a point by simultaneously selecting the point with one finger and using another to control the zoom.

      The post title, summary, and the article itself all make it sound like Apple is patenting all touch-screen gestures, but that's not what the patent application itself says.
    • Apple's implementation is much snappier!

    • Re:Prior Art (Score:3, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Uhh dude... i don't think anyone wants to know what you are doing with your palm right now..

    • Re:Prior Art (Score:4, Informative)

      by dr.badass (25287) on Saturday February 04 2006, @06:21PM (#14643507) Homepage
      What the heck am I doing on my Palm right now?

      Using a one-point stylus. The patent application is for gestures using multiple points simultaneously. You can't do that with your Palm. Also note that it isn't a patent on multi-point touch screens or touch pads, which already exist, but on specific types of interfaces using them.
    • It's true. The only question now is did anyone ever run black and white on a touchscreen. Possibly a moot point as nVidia have had gestures on thie driver software for a while now.
    • Not to mention the numerous Nintendo DS games that have this feature
      • Not to mention the numerous Nintendo DS games that have this feature

        The DS has, as far as I know, a single-point touch screen. The patent application is for gestures using multiple points. I don't have a DS, so tell me: can you touch the screen in two different points and have two different inputs register? Or does the cursor "leap" like most touchpads?
    • Black & White with a touch screen. If you've got it set up to emulate a mouse then it's actually quite fun to play with a touch screen.

      If you've got it set up to emulate a mouse, then you're only using one point to make gestures. The patent application covers gestures using multiple points (like using two fingers on a touch screen or a touch pad). Black and White does not have that.
      • Actually, I fail to see how. The touch screen reacts the same whether I use one finger or two. The patent is vague (pretty typical for these kind of things), and to be honest probably worthless.

        Besides, what's Apple going to do then? Sue the priest at my local Catholic church because he happens to mark the stations on the cross with two fingers during service????

        • Re:Prior Art Example... (Score:5, Funny)

          by dr.badass (25287) on Saturday February 04 2006, @08:00PM (#14643797) Homepage
          The touch screen reacts the same whether I use one finger or two.

          That's because it's a single-point screen. Multiple-point touch screens (i.e. the only kind referenced by the patent application) behave differently.

          The patent is vague

          You've already demonstrated that you haven't read any of it. The very first claim specifies "touch sensitive device having a multipoint capability".

          Besides, what's Apple going to do then? Sue the priest...

          Now you're demonstrating that you are being willfully stupid.
      • Actually, Apple practically invented the whole handheld PC industry with the Newton. It wasn't a "pre-existing technique", they had it first.

        Plus, I believe that prior art is not subject to copyright law, so things like the Palm Pilot, the Nintendo DS, and other things are exempt.

        Not that I agree with Apple doing this. Part of the reason that they do this is probably because of their past when they got totally screwed over by MS, and they just don't want it to happen again.

        And Sony has no right to g

        • They invented the PDA, not the "Hand held PC" industry. Casio, Sharp, and Psion were selling pocketable, handheld, personal computers throughout most of the eighties (the Psion Organiser series was pretty much a yuppie icon at one point.) All were programmable in a high level language (which could be done on the machine itself) and most in assembly if need be; they all included removable storage and had alphanumeric input features.

          If you're talking literally about handheld PCs (as in PC clones), then Atar

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